User talk:Rapta/Archive 15

New build Archive:R/D PvE Scythe Ranger
Hi Rapta, you gave the build a bad score which I see why now, I comletely redid the whole build and dropped the pet. IMO its a damn good build now. Was just hoping you could rethink your vote. Cheers mate! --Angelus 17:44, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Archive:R/D Wounding Strike Spammer already covers it, no? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 19:12, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Mine is pretty different enough imo. dont you think?--[[Image:AngelusShove.jpg‎]]Angelus 22:43, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Not really. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 13:29, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Deletion again (Symbolic Strike)
This time we were in the middle of discussing the inferior status. Also, it had only been up for about an hour, two at most. Choytw Talk Debates 13:49, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * That's quite a long time. Plus, it was tagged. You were informed of this deletion, and the BM's statement is more than enough. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 13:49, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * No, it's not, the build was still being worked on.  Also, his reason for being inferior ignored the other builds lack of any skills regarding overpowering defenses, something he said my build was bad for earlier. [[Image:choytw_sig_1.JPG|20px]]Choytw Talk Debates  13:51, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Well here's what I'd written before he deleted it: ''Sigh. Stop nitpicking holes in arguments. It's all I've seen you do on this wiki. Bull's Strike along with Eviscerate and a +36 Symbolic is a mini spike, exactly the same as a standard Eviscerate bar. Bull's doesn't require adrenaline, can be used more, and gives you a nice +20-30 damage when it lands. Backbreaker takes forever to charge, is easy to prevent being charged, doesn't do the nice +damage, and leaves you with no remaining skill slots to take advantage of the KD. You have no deep wound, no versitile disruption with a reasonable recharge, no fast spike. Warrior's Cunning is not a good counter to blocks. It's a spike assist with a horrendously long recharge that is practically useless when a good build gives you the same window of opportinity without taking up a skill slot. --Tab  Moo  13:51, 20 June 2008 (EDT)'' I was practically done discussing the build anyway, all that's happened is that it's progressed from one terrible skill combo that is a result of not enoguh skill slots to another to another. --Tab  Moo  13:51, 20 June 2008 (EDT)


 * So when you critiqued the build and said it assumed a poor defense, what did you mean? [[Image:choytw_sig_1.JPG|20px]]Choytw Talk Debates 13:53, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * First of all, that was when it had Symbolic and Forceful. Secondly, I meant that you were relying on bad monks in order to get kills. You still are (Backbreaker charges sufficiently slowly that unless you can pressure in other ways, such as Bull's Strike - which you can't with that bar - it's ridiculously easy to prevent you from doing anything.) --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]Tab  Moo  13:56, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * How does the superior build do any better? The elite has 8 adrenaline, and the kd has a recharge of 10s (i believe I can get 10 adrenaline in about the same time or quicker than 10s) and it can do nothing if guardian or one of the epic ranger defensive skills are used. [[Image:choytw_sig_1.JPG|20px]]Choytw Talk Debates  13:59, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * The build doesn't have deep wound. The build doesn't have Bull's Strike. A build shouldn't be centered in on one random skill (especially one that requires you to gimp half your bar like Symbolic Strike to use). &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:01, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It's capable of pressuring in the elite's downtime due to not being a hammer bar(as I said, hammers rely on KDs to pressure). The mini spikes it performs are capable of killing due to having Deep Wound and more damage. Evisc wars are alot harder to prot against than Symbolic Strike spammers with a single KD every 15 seconds or so (that's optimistic). --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]Tab  Moo  14:02, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

(ec) It was in trial, and not a stub. If it's still an undecided concept, then it shouldn't be in Trial, but in stubs instead. Trial is for minor changes after a build's concept is finalized. The premise for deletion was its concept. If it's still being worked on, it should be a stub. &mdash; Rapta   (talk|contribs) 13:53, 20 June 2008 (EDT)


 * Roger that, would you put it back up and I can change to stub status? [[Image:choytw_sig_1.JPG|20px]]Choytw Talk Debates 13:54, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Very much appreciated. Tab, want to take the discussion back there? [[Image:choytw_sig_1.JPG|20px]]Choytw Talk Debates  14:00, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Rapta
I made a template for another tnp userbox why was it moved to my userspace and isnt a template anymoar? --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:23, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I wouldn't know. I only deleted the redirect. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:24, 21 June 2008 (EDT)


 * (ec)Use . That doesn't have any use in mainspace. &mdash;  Skakid  14:25, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * What do you mean? --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:26, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I can't be any more specific. &mdash;  Skakid  14:27, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * (ec) Exactly what it says. It has no purpose being in the main namespace. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:28, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It has, so pplz can add it to their userpages! :D like In thing. --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:29, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * You're not funny. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:30, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * .....They can add it without it being in mainspace. Mainspace isn't for where we keep templates based around a big retarded circle jerk. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  14:30, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Why me? : '( *crys* Ah well, I just dont like when my stuff gets moved or deleted >.< --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:35, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Oh, templates on other pages still work, oh thats fine then. :P --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:36, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * That only happens because you persistently do the same dumb stuff over and over. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  14:37, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * No, I just made a template, its not stupid! >:( --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:46, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I'm pretty sure that Guild Wars is rated T. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:47, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Yea Im sure it is too. :P --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  14:49, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

read the usage of the build bfor rating it.  That  Twin   Tom  04:23, 22 June 2008 (EDT)
 * What are you talking about? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 20:35, 22 June 2008 (EDT)
 * the build 1 doesnt have mystic regen. 2. life siphon is used to power bonds. 3. read the variants/optional( order of pain). no build ever deserves 0-0-0 btw. [[Image:That Twin Tom sig.jpg|19px]] That  Twin   Tom  02:35, 23 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It had MR when the vote was made. Life Siphon is a bad skill in general, no matter what it's used to "power". There are builds that deserve 0-0-0 - nonfunctioning ones like this one. In any case, my point reflects not only the main bar now, but the variants section too. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 13:32, 23 June 2008 (EDT)
 * is the variant in the talk ok then? and no build deserves 0-0-0 because any build can always be used sumwhere. just not effectively. or it cud be a bad idea. [[Image:That Twin Tom sig.jpg|19px]] That  Twin   Tom  02:59, 24 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Builds are voted upon relatively within the confines of the voting system. Thus, a 5-5-5 need not be a perfect (unable to be countered) build, because no such build exists, it need only be one of the best builds which can be produced within the GW environs.  Similarly, a build which can be used somewhere, but which might as well not work at all can be given a 0-0-0 rating (along with builds that rely on nonfunctional mechanics, etc.).  [[Image:Defiant Elements Sig Test 2.JPG|50x19px]]  *Defiant Elements*   +talk  05:21, 24 June 2008 (EDT)
 * you just sed lots of really long words :? [[Image:That Twin Tom sig.jpg|19px]] That  Twin   Tom  12:08, 24 June 2008 (EDT)
 * basically, no build is perfect, so when someone votes a 5-5-5 its because a build it great, but not perfect. when someone votes a 0-0-0, its because the build should never be used, not that it literally has 0 innovation or whatever.[[Image:Saintsigpic.jpg|19px]]<font color="Silver"> Saint  12:15, 24 June 2008 (EDT)
 * yh yh [[Image:That Twin Tom sig.jpg|19px]] That  Twin   Tom  15:25, 24 June 2008 (EDT)

Baleeting My Shit.
You keep on deleting my build that's a variant in the AP Nuker page. The "Frozen Flames Variant". First--you delete it off the AP Nuker page, it was listed as a variant on the page. Then Skakid told me to go ahead and make a new page since it's a different build, then since by you--it's a dupe?!?. I'd like a revert or you can stop baleeting it off the AP Nuker page.--Rella 23:16, 24 June 2008 (EDT)
 * First of all, "baleeting" isn't a word and using it doesn't help you get your point across. I'd advise against using it. Second, it's just a random AP build with deep freeze. It's not unique. It doesn't require its own page, nor does it require a huge skill bar on the existing page. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 11:55, 25 June 2008 (EDT)
 * "Baleeting" is a perfectly cromulent word. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  11:59, 25 June 2008 (EDT)
 * "The sheep baleeted in the fields until night came." It's a word alright. --Guild of Deals<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 12:37, 26 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It's not a word for this context. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:03, 26 June 2008 (EDT)

Delete build
Can you delete this please :< Build:W/Mo Charging Strike Ganker -- <font color="#900020">Lann 14:01, 26 June 2008 (EDT)
 * One appears to be a "Ganker" and the other for whatever. I wouldn't know (I never use Charging Strike). &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 14:04, 26 June 2008 (EDT)
 * They are both for splits. At least thats what the descript on says. Plus mendingtouch is in the variants of . --[[Image:Lann-sf2.jpg|19px|19px]] <font color="#900020">Lann  16:57, 26 June 2008 (EDT)

Build:N/A Solo Boss Farmer‎
Keep it in testing, though half the bar is missing those 4 skills are the only ones needed to farm bosses tbh. --<font color="black" face="hyborian">GRAARR  / RESETTI  Crossfire  15:57, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Stop posting garbage on my talk page when there's already a discussion on the Build's talk page. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 15:58, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Well excuse me...--[[Image:Mister Resetti.jpg|21px]]<font color="black" face="hyborian">GRAARR  / RESETTI  Crossfire  15:59, 27 June 2008 (EDT)

Hey
What do you think of this build :) -- <font color="#900020">Lann 16:33, 27 June 2008 (EDT)

Me/N MoR Nightmare
Your vote seems to misunderstand the purpose/underestimate the effectiveness of ether nightmare + CoP spam--Goldenstar 17:24, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * No, not really. It's pretty straightforward. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:33, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Straightforward but wrong. --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  17:34, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * TBH, degen still isn't good compared to blunt straight-up damage. It's nice to have along, but not something to focus on, especially as a Hex for CoP. --Guild of Deals<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 17:35, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Have anything to back that up? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:36, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Me, him, or both? --Guild of Deals<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 17:36, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Indents indicate that it was a reply to User:Super Igor. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:37, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Yup, en first of all gives large aoe degen, indeed degen is not worth basing your build upon in pve and that build doesnt do that but en makes the best option to fuel cop's large aoe damage among other mesmer hexes it doesnt requre any additional attribute point investement. --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  17:53, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Like I said, farming PvE titles is zzzzz. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:54, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Have anything to back that up? If this is a personal opinion it doesnt mean that it is right and effects everyone. --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  17:57, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Make a poll (not on here) if you want. I heard that winning polls on PvX makes you a better GW player. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:59, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * (EC)And yeah even if some people find title grinding boring, it doesnt make en + cop a bad combo as it doesnt make en a bad option to fuel cop's massive aoe damage aswell, widely approved fact. Also, this discussion turns to a retarded chat fight with only porpose to win, I know that you are leading to it, can see that already, sorry, find another partner for that. :) --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  18:05, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I missed that last statement, you'll have to reword it. And CoP can be meh at high levels (12s recharge is not extremely brilliant). You missed the "versatility is gimped by dedicating your entire bar to try to spam it" point in your slew of theorycrafting there. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 18:16, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * No, wop has really high armor ignoring damage aswell as very fast activation time, only drawback is relatively long rechrge, this why people try to echo/arcane echo it and/or lower its recharge, because it is actually worth dedicating your entire bar for that rememmber it is infact the best skill that makes mesmers viable in pve and makes them deal considerable ammount of aoe damage which is more than usefull, infact, a must in pve game enviroment, as for high level lets assume elite missions, a cryway mesmer group does deep run in 19 minutes, how come its bad? --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  18:22, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * So what exactly were you referring to with the "Doesn't require attribute investment" comment? That's not really relevant since you're dedicating your bar to the skill anyways. And Deep builds certainly require a specific team, in which case, is irrelevant, since you were QQing about some solo Cry of Pain build anyways. And I'm pretty sure that no one said that CoP is bad outright (so I'm not sure what you're getting so worked up about with respect to that either). It can "make mesmers viable" isn't really a point either. Also, I'm sure you can even run Cry of Pain on a Warrior. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 18:27, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * (ecx2)What i was referring to? I was referring to en, as opposed to certain mesmer hexes that could be used to power up cop en doesnt requre any additional attribute point investement it is infact a strong point, I am not QQing about the build, i am not QQing at all dont make this discussion go into personal flaming, my whole point is that chining cop with en is probably the best option for the tactic, also "cop makes mesmers viable as it makes them deal large aoe damage" is a point, because the only thing you really want to do in pve is deal huge damages, it is what mesmers lacked for a long time and is also the main reason for building your bar around spamming the spell as it has a rather long recharge time, I actually dont understand how it gimps its versatility said as of "versatility is gimped by dedicating your entire bar to try to spam it". --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  18:40, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * What personal flaming? And yes, AoE damage is useful, no one's debating that. You said something about CoP being unlinked to attribs makes it better, and I'm saying that's not really relevant since you're running a bar dedicated to that anyways (even if it was linked, you'd spec into it). &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 18:45, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It was about en, kinda makes it a good hex to start off cop and lets you invest into other stuff in theory, misread the versatilitything though, ye it may narrow versatility but on a second thought what else you would ever do in pve as a mesmer apart from dealing masses of aoe damage and kill stuff and thats pretty much is the goal of pve, it also has an interrupt so you can prevent some dangerous spells from being cast :P bit like ms/db spamming these builds are. Anyway, ether nightmare + cop is a good and powerfull combo and both are powerfull skills worth using and echoing or whatever, Im sleepy, tired of this debate. :P --  Super Igor  *ninja!!*  19:16, 27 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Ether Nightmare sucks. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:47, 27 June 2008 (EDT)