Archive talk:R/D Escape Scythe

Discussion
Pious assault is changed... 10 mana cost now, I also don't see how this has benifit over expert dexterity scythe spammer...-- Frans  18:09, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * Deep wound, enchantment removal, and more survivability/nrg managment?-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * I think this needs more IAS...-- Korineczek --( Toalk -- Koantribooshns ) 03:57, 19 January 2008 (EST)
 * Needs more bunnies.  Mike Tycn ( punch   out )  05:46, 19 January 2008 (EST)
 * That's basically why it got those fast attack skills. But Lightning Reflexes would be nice anyway. - Star Seeker  |  My talk  05:48, 19 January 2008 (EST)
 * *cough* RaO *cough*  Mike Tycn ( punch   out )  05:49, 19 January 2008 (EST)

Meh. Like the current one better. - Star Seeker  |  My talk  07:10, 19 January 2008 (EST)
 * Someone could make a RaO one,but since this is a RA/AB/CM build it needs survivability moar then damage.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 

Needs IAS--Goldenstar 10:54, 19 January 2008 (EST)
 * Done.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 

Always called this Scythe Ranger :D. Bunny Reaper is just as good. Pious Assault made this even better. It pwned already before. I like crippling victory, it's in variants right?--Relyk 00:00, 10 February 2008 (EST)

PvE only variant?
I use this in PvE, it uses the PvE skill Never rampage alone for an IAS and the fact you don't need enchant removal, res or self heal in general questing PvE. [build prof=R/D Expertise=10+3+1 Scythe=12 Beast=8+1][Pious Assault][Eremite's Attack][Victorious Sweep][Zealous Sweep][Escape][Never Rampage Alone][Comfort Animal][Charm Animal][/build] (edit) forgot to sign >.< Justing6 19:22, 27 January 2008 (EST)
 * No, victorious is bad. Sup is bad. no chilling victory is bad.--Relyk 01:16, 22 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Meh, just noticed what I wrote, you don't ned that much expertise it just means you have to be careful with your energy, and not spam when you get stretched. A major rune is fine, but victorius and zealous are unnecessary in most situations. Res is gud 2 btw.--Relyk 01:21, 14 April 2008 (EDT)

AB/CM/Possible PvE Variant
Have fun:

-- Guild of  Deals  18:23, 4 February 2008 (EST)

More like:


 * D--Relyk 23:52, 9 February 2008 (EST)
 * Reap Impurities is bad. You already have a self heal. R/D Scythe Rangers are about spamming quick attacks. --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  16:05, 11 February 2008 (EST)

Erm....
Who took Chilling Victory out? Not smart. Zuranthium 15:37, 11 February 2008 (EST)

Zealous Sweep
Sucks and is a waste of a slot. &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  15:58, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * The build has energy problems. Rend Touch + Chilling + Pious + Eremites + Escape eat up ALL your energy and then some. The last two slots need to be very cheap (Zealous gives you +1 net energy). I'll just do multiple optional slots, though. Crippling Victory + Antidote Signet can work too. Zuranthium 16:04, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * I've been using this since the Pious buff and have had no energy problems running a Sundering scythe. =/ &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  16:05, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * I agree with Zura, it does have energy problems. I've used it a lot and it does as long as you continually spam. Lyssa's Assault would be good if this has an enchantment, but it doesn't. --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  16:06, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * Because 1 energy every 10 seconds really helps (unless you're againast a terrible team). &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  16:08, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * 1 extra energy helps more than another skill that you can't use in the first place because it costs energy (it CAN give you more than +1, btw, if you hit multiple targets). Every 12 seconds it costs 16+ energy to use the 5 main skills of the bar to maximum effect, and you only regen 12 energy in 12 seconds as a Ranger. Zuranthium 16:10, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * Hence why I said, only against bad teams. Also, math fails @ GW, never use it. &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  16:14, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * Whatever you may think about the math, I've played the build and the energy is an issue. The last two skill slots need to be very cost-friendly. Zuranthium 16:17, 11 February 2008 (EST)
 * To clarify, so the discussion sounds less hostile, the specific Scythe Ranger bar you run is less energy intensive (no Eremite's Attack). That's where the confusion was likely coming from, when you said that there were no energy problems. Zuranthium 04:04, 12 February 2008 (EST)
 * Its fine in the optional lets leave it there, some people can't manage nrg.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 

Apply Poison
Pressure and a cover for DW that works just as well at 4 spec as 10. -Shen 12:30, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * energy wont permit &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  12:31, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * Yea, I voted when chilling victory wasn't in the bar. -Shen 12:31, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * But I don't get why Unexist removed my vote suggesting AP with "mentions AP on a physical" as a reason. -Shen 12:42, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * even after chilling i run apply not rly a problem for me.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * Aesthetic.Read it. -Shen 14:00, 16 February 2008 (EST)

PvE Version
[build prof=r/d exp=12+1+1 sc=12][wounding strike][victorious sweep][mystic sweep][eremite's attack][lightning reflexes][dwarven stability][aura of holy might][sunspear rebirth signet][/build]

22 secs of lightning reflexes @ rank 10 = gud. Rickyvantof 15:35, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * i thought of that,A/D scythesins are better at pve 94.2%.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * I suppose. But it's a good build for people who want a ranger build, lulz. Rickyvantof 15:48, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * so is barrage-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * also having a build with only 1 alike skill isnt a variant.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * Did I ever say this should be a variant? I said it's the  PvE Version as in, same concept, different skills, meant for PvE. Rickyvantof 18:26, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * Also, just because Barrage works very well on a ranger, does that mean that's the only viable build? Rickyvantof 18:27, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * Yeah, this would pwn as pve build.--Relyk 14:40, 15 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Althought scythesins would have more damage output this would be much better in PvE because there's a lot less stance removing than enchantment removing plus rangers have more armor against elemental makes this a much better choice. Imbagon

HA tag
Add HA tag to it? This seems to be the new meta. (Crippling Victory and Lightning Reflexes or a spirit in the 2 optionals). Drag nmn  talk cont  14:06, 2 March 2008 (EST)
 * add if you see it fit. i never HA or obs it.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] aesthetic
 * lol, this definitely the meta ATM 67.162.10.70 22:50, 3 March 2008 (EST)
 * Added.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] aesthetic

Dumb
I've seen six people today with this stupid build, ANet you need to do some nerfing there. And while you're at it nerf that ridicolous DA spam shit with A/Mo and N/A(!) its goddamn killing the fun in this game.
 * Mesmers and Necros can shut these down fairly easily. Also, use a stance. - zomg!  [[Image:panic_sig.png|19px]]  PANIC!  09:17, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * Agreed, builds that will be/are nerfed suck. Gimmick builds ftw.[[Image:Styxx_HL.jpg|19px]] Frans  09:20, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * According to Rawr and Ska R/D is a gimmick. Plus, they probably won't nerf this. They'd have to faec raep Pious and then everyone would QQ about that instead. - zomg!  [[Image:panic_sig.png|19px]]  PANIC!  09:22, 6 March 2008 (EST)

Its really easy to counter this build. If you're a caster, you just have to stop trying to kite them because their damage double if your moving because they crit you all the time. Next time you're attacked by one of those. Just stand still, you will see how much their damage blows. -Rekiem
 * They can get crits when you stand still, too, and the damage doesn't blow.....the core problem is that new Pious
 * Assault, it's just waaaaaaaaay overdone too strong.
 * As a melee you can't hit them and get raped, as a caster unless u're necro you get raped.....duh.
 * Necro, Mesmer, Ele, or even Rit has ways to deal with this. Standard anti-melee ways. - zomg!  [[Image:panic_sig.png|19px]]  PANIC!  14:32, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * Which is the whole point of GW... If no one would be ale to deal with this then it wouldn't be fun it is now. God  box   15:13, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * Seems like they listened LOL! Pious has normal act. time again. But they also nerfed other skills into oblivion.
 * They aren't paying attention to the escape scythe -_-', the derv spikers using grenths aura and pious assault were nerfed.--Relyk 11:15, 7 March 2008 (EST)

Archive, or, remove votes?
This had gotten pretty popular. Shall we leave it as a memory or keep it around as another "pretty good" build? Zuranthium 16:54, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * I think so. its been around long enough.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] aesthetic

Still pretty good even w/o the 3/4 pious. Just slower spikes (barely). Jak123X 21:58, 6 March 2008 (EST)

Wild blow
Why are people complaining so much about this? Anyone with wild blow destroys these guys. With only 12 scythe mastery and such a long recharge on their attack skills, these guys really don't do all that much damage. Shadowmind 04:15, 9 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Why would people be using monks so much? Anyone with MB can counter them.
 * Name one PvP build that is on PvX and favored that uses Wild Blow. Gogogogo. --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  10:26, 9 March 2008 (EDT)
 * AoM. -Shen 10:27, 9 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Depends on the AoM. We have one D/A or one D/W one. Anyway, I wouldn't see people running this in GvG/HA (where it's meta). --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  10:31, 9 March 2008 (EDT)
 * its meta in GvG??? anyways AoMs use bull's now. its better.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] aesthetic

Still
Used (in HA). &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  13:30, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

I'd like to hear (from Rapta if possible, it was his edit on 3/9/08) why Lightning Reflexes should be main bar. I can see how it slightly compensates for the Pious nerf, but LR has little synergy with Escape (lose your speed boost, wasted elite for 11/30 secs). I liked it better w/ 2 optionals :)--JenniferBelle 20:07, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * He wanted to be primarily PvE, where enemies don't kite and the 33% IAS + block chance 1/3 of the time is an obvious choice. &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  20:09, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Block stance and an IAS. It's gud.(Edit: lulz, looks like ska and i managed to update at the same time XD)--Goldenstar 20:09, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Both are used in HA. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 20:46, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * This build was used in GvG last night by my guils oponents and they completely smashed our team to pieces, they had 3 ranger/dervishes running this and 3 necros (one Tainted flesh and 2 N/Rt healers) and 1 prot monk --Firadesunna 06:59, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Wow what a gay build. You should've been able to win, regardless. &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  22:12, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

This build...
Is rated great?! After playing with it for awhile I just don't see why it's rated so high. It's practically useless in PvP, especially in RA. --Hawk Skeer 19:52, 27 March 2008 (EDT)
 * lol@u. It isn't really built for RA, but it works there.  19:56, 27 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Well, it says designed for use in RA, remove that too then. If a build says it's designed for x, it should perform decently in x, and able to be rated on by that factor. But I never mentioned RA once in my rating, and here I said "especially in RA" not "in RA". I was rating it by PvP in general. I destroy these things every time they swing their scythes at me, and I've never seen a successful one. Anywhere in PvP. --Hawk Skeer 20:02, 27 March 2008 (EDT)


 * U fail, this is a coolest and dumbest to use build evva. --/\/\/\[[Image:SuperIgorsig.jpg|19px]]Игорь</tt> 20:08, 27 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Observe GvG/HA much? They are all the rage.  20:12, 27 March 2008 (EDT)
 * This isn't even half bad for RA. But seriously, just no. --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  20:22, 27 March 2008 (EDT)
 * TBH this pwns RA. blockfags+ damage + anti-prot=good.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] <font color="Black">aesthetic
 * This is a great RA build just add antidote signet to the open slot. It does good (although not great) damage it has strong survivability because of the two 75% block against melee skills + 100 armor against elemental damage, enchantment sripping for getting through guardian or removing armor enchantments and antidote signet allows it to deal with blind and finally the scythe along with the hammer has the best hp gain from vampiric mod which gets even better when hitting multiple people allowing it to live a bit longer. It's all around a great balance of damage output and survivability for RA. My question for Hawkseeker would be what do you play that you destroy these and do they have a healer? A build doesn't suck just because you can kill them in RA since the teams are very random. --Malcanthet 01:24, 3 July 2008 (EDT)


 * Anything and everything works in RA. I've used the bars that come equipped with a new PvP character and still won. Imbagon

Oh Man
A week ago I wouldn't have said this, since I was having so much fun not failing in HA. But now I say please nerf this!! Its messing alot of the pvp up. First off, block block block block + High armor against elemental= Hard to kill. Secondly, crazy pressure;snaring;spiking;annoying and taking monks and enchantments overall out of use. In every other RA you see at least one of these guys. Come on guys >< Whos with me. Jax010 01:00, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I'm with ya Jax. High armor against elemental damage, good at catching kiting foes, good pressure, good spiking, very difficult to hit with melee, enchantment stripping, anything else? lol I have to admit I've been abusing this build in RA lately. I have a feeling we're going to see a nerf to Escape. I can just see it now... Escape: For 1...7 seconds you move 33% faster and have a 75% chance to block attacks. Escape ends if you successfully hit with an attack. Boom, now Escape works very similarly to Dark Escape. The PvE runners are happy because it doesn't affect them at all, and this build completely dies. :P Zephyr Cloud  [[Image:zeph_sig.jpg]] 03:43, 8 April 2008 (EDT)
 * They'll nerf energy cost on non-ranger attack skills, most likely. It would mess up the build pretty hard.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 03:46, 8 April 2008 (EDT)

I'd say the A/D OoA sins are much more overpowered then this, they rip prots off withe very attack. And do solid crits with 100+ dmg hits. (Mr Pink57 01:23, 11 April 2008 (EDT))
 * OoA is very costly, though.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 01:28, 11 April 2008 (EDT)

Scythes need a nerf. Everything else is just a symptom. --71.229.204.25 01:37, 11 April 2008 (EDT)
 * True. The problem that of a weapon hitting up to three targets and dealing 100 damage on each hit, with chilling and splinter you deal about 300 damage to all adjacent targets. Craziness. God  box   14:49, 15 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Oh, and I'm not with you. I want to keep this at least until I've managed to get to r3 with Sway, then I don't give a fuck. God  box   14:58, 15 April 2008 (EDT)

Doesn't seem that overpowered honestly. It could be compared to a flashings blades sins in terms of counters. Only difference is the armor against elemental damage. -Wings of Peace
 * No, flashing blades is bad and escape scythe is good(er then flashingblades.). -brandnew
 * Flashing Blades is so much worse than Escape... 50%, While attacking, no speed buff, etc... And Brandnew, sign your comments with 4 ~'s.  06:32, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

It isn't scythes that are the problem, It's expertise. Expertise just screams "Use me in a gimmick build!"

Honestly I don't see this build as much of a problem. It's just a matter of shutting it down via hexes. Empathy+Insidious for example. Degen shuts this down pretty fast too. Expose defenses? Bam. Hell WoH monks with guardian can even ignore this build fairly easily if they know what they're doing. Even a dark pact necro could take this down pretty easy. -Wings of Peace
 * Ye, but this just is the new IWAY, its a group of unranked PUG's screaming OMG I want mai bambi tooooo. And as this takes little to no skill to play, they play this. <font color="black" face="Tahoma">Brandnew      pew pew me!

I'm not certain what you mean by skill to play. If you mean simply spam the buttons then that's pretty much true of any build. And as a second counter argument to that point I'd argue that the real skill in using a build is in the players ability to use it well in sync with the rest of their team. Still not terribly difficult but in my personal experience it's what I believe puts the real skill into pvp and to a smaller extend pve. If on the other hand you mean it takes no skill in that you wiki for maybe three mins and no amount of personal thought finding a dramatically effective build for both pve and pvp then yes I agree that is definately a flaw. But at the same time that point would also be true of any build found on this wiki. Wings of Peace 03:41, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * If you are just spamming the buttons on a Shock Axe, you are doing it wrong. If you are just spamming buttons on an Escape Scythe, you are doing it right. Difference. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  03:45, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * My two cents:
 * Scythes might be the problem, but a lesser one. What I don't like seeing are R/D and A/D builds that put scythes to better use than a lot of derv primary builds. Scythes are a derv's weapon, they should be the best at using them.
 * Expertise might also be part of the problem, but it is unlikely to be touched. Most ranger builds that rely on expertise to make skills from some other profession "better" usually fail - this is one exception.
 * This build IS strong. Saying it's not much of a problem because melee counters like hexes and blind hurt it is missing the point. You have a build that has 100 armor against elemental damage, 75% coverage (8/12 seconds) of 75% block and 33% IAS, a cheap yet powerful spike, and a good enchantment remover. You don't have to manage adrenalin and with your buff armor vs. elements and 75% block you're as much of a tank as a warrior. This makes the build easy to play while still being effective, which is why you see lots of people running this as a quick and easy way to win. Call them noob, lazy, whatever - the build works.
 * I really think changing Escape to function like Dark Escape will fix this build. My rationale is this: who the hell escapes towards the enemy? If you're escaping, you're not chasing your opponent down to spike him... unless you're Chuck Norris (yea I know that fad died months ago, sue me).
 * The real problem is the A/D builds lol. Taking the highest damage weapon type in the game and guaranteeing you'll land critical hits at least 80-90% of the time... imba. Toss in Dark Apostasy and... common, just look at Archive:A/D Dark Apostasy Scythe and tell me that isn't over the top. -_- Zephyr Cloud  [[Image:zeph_sig.jpg]] 03:51, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * So then you agree that scythes are the real problem. --71.229.204.25 04:21, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I always fail to hit several targets, but I'm not rly good at GW.[[Image:Impossible_Odds.jpg‎|19px]] Frans  04:23, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

Scythes are a huge problem; critting for 150 damage without an attack skill simply should never happen. Lowering the damage would help immensely; even dervs do too much damage using scythes, critting for 150 isn't reserved for rangers and sins. Rending Touch, however, is the single most broken skill on the bar, and it has nothing to do with expertise or attack skills. Removing channeling on recharge, stripping attunes with ease, 3 of these R/Ds completely de-protting a ghostly hero... it's rather stupid. Expertise has been fine for years now. Scythe attack skills, however, have never been balanced. No energy skill should be able to apply Deep Wound; it was a problem with assassins since factions (twisting, and more recently augury) and with dervs come nightfall (wounding strike, reapers sweep, wearying strike, and now pious assault). They have all been broken, because the recharges have simply been ridiculously short. Eviscerate, the staple melee elite, is capable of applying Deep Wound roughly every 20 seconds; why on earth would they give a non-elite skill shorter recharge than that? It blows my mind. Oh, escape should end on attack. Lightning Reflexes is pretty powerful, but isn't quite imba. - Auron 04:45, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Scythes crit damage is too high, I agree with you there. They are a bit too good at facilitating nasty melee spikes. I think that's a smaller problem with this build than it is for A/D builds, but I guess the best evidence that scythes are too strong is the fact that non-primaries can use them to such great extent, which is what bugs me. I agree that expertise is not the problem with this build. It certainly helps it out, but it's not what makes it so strong. Rending Touch is strong, and you make a good argument for why it's a problem. I don't know what they should do about it though, as I don't know if it's necessarily imba on W/D bars. In the end I would just like to see them nerf escape to end on attack and see how things play out from there. Lightning Reflexes doesn't need a nerf, though you're right about it being quite powerful. Zephyr Cloud  [[Image:zeph_sig.jpg]] 13:47, 28 April 2008 (EDT)
 * 'The real problem is the A/D builds lol. Taking the highest damage weapon type in the game and guaranteeing you'll land critical hits at least 80-90% of the time... imba.' Calculations? -- ☭ M3at wad..  (talk) 00:52, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Closer to 50% of the time. --71.229 01:03, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * My apologies for the miscalculations. Assuming a target just stands there, you're looking at more like 62% chance to crit (31% from Way of the Master + 14% from crit strikes + ~17% from 12 scythe mastery). Zephyr Cloud  [[Image:zeph_sig.jpg]] 20:58, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Most crits come from kiting tbh. I know there are lots of people who are of the school of thought that you should just stop kiting from scythes. This is not an ideal solution as you will still soak up probably about the same amount of damage(unless they are significantly faster than you). All the critical boosting really achieves is more damage on stationary targets or the hits you land when they stop to cast. The better part of being a primary assassin is probably actually Assassin's Remedy which is an awesome skill, especially with Wearying Strike. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  03:30, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I can't find any information on how much Fleeing boosts your odds of a critical hit, so I can't run the math, but with all the shadowsteps and Dash, it might actually be better off to just take the beating instead of kiting. --71.229 04:29, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Fleeing gives 100% crit chance. Sucks to kite eh? But unless you are snared, I'd still kite most of the time. Kiting tends to drop attack rate below 50%. I usually throw up a Guardian, kite, Shield Bash their next attack skill, kite some more while they are knocked down. Laugh. If you time your casting/kiting right then you will always be "stationary" when they hit you and you win at Guild Wars. Fast activation skills might let them get an extra crit on you. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  04:39, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * If people are getting their face beat in by an R/D, then they don't usually have enough sense to kite and pause when they see the scythe backing up for a swing. So it's better that they just stand still rather than constantly run. Also, most people don't run that sexy Shield Bash of yours. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  05:18, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Most people don't win at Guild Wars. I don't win at Guild Wars :( - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  05:20, 29 April 2008 (EDT) I blame the internets.
 * Shield bash wins tbh. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  05:23, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I run Dark Escape/Return 'cause I'm not manly. ): --71.229 05:25, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * The only excuse to drop Shield Bash on an arena monk is Dshot. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  05:28, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * You should run Dark Escape, Return, AND Shield bash. Literally just those three skills. Your balls will descend to your ankles, you'll get a ZZTop beard, and your pecs will ripple like Arnold Schwarzeneggar's. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  05:29, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Echo Shield Bash? :D --71.229 05:38, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * You can double echo it too if you want. Then you just need something else spammable and annoying from the mesmer or warrior lines. - The preceeding comment wasn't signed by Panic because he's not had enough coffee yet.
 * Wastrel's Worry spam ofc. --71.229 05:44, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I'm back to balanced stance because of all the crit scythers <3 <font color="black" face="Tahoma">Brandnew      pew pew me!      05:46, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Females of all species will flock to you because of your smothering aura of testosterone. gogogogo! - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  05:48, 29 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Alright, somebody get on it! I expect to see a screen shot of a A/W with nothing but Dark Escape, Return, and Shield Bash on their bar with "10 consecutive wins" up on the screen lol. Zephyr Cloud  [[Image:zeph_sig.jpg]] 21:12, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

Heros
cant seem to use 'escape' very well - or at least my Jin i have never seen her use it...

its a great build but maybe stick something else in the place of Escape for heros.

anybody else agree???

I ran with a hero with running skills & i could be just about to dissapear off radar but the hero has never once activated the 5 running skills equipped....

anybody agree on this??

78.151.129.81 08:06, 4 May 2008 (EDT)
 * nope.put escape all the way to the left and your good.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] <font color="Black">aesthetic

this is poopy now
topic says it all....and it makes my peepee soft.Majikpsilocybin 01:06, 23 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Believe it or not, an extra quarter second activation on Eremite's Attack did not totally ruin this build. In fact it affected this build substantially less than most dervishes or critscythes due to them using Mystic as well. Needs to be nerfed harder if anet wants it out of use. That being said sometimes stuff falls out of use after minor nerfs just because of people QQing so maybe I should shut up about it being a small nerf and hope it just dies anyway. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  03:08, 23 May 2008 (EDT)
 * gl with that  Antiarchangel [[Image:Antiarchangel No U Sig.png|19px]] <font color=#C0641B>TROLL  23:55, 23 May 2008 (EDT)

Sundering Scythe Suggested
I suggest putting in Sundering Scythe instead of Vampiric. The DPS from Vampiric is helpful, but since this is mainly a spike, that overall DPS isn't going to help much. The critical from Sundering can be badass and since the high damage of the scythe is there, it will work out well.
 * Sundering only adds 2 dps, rather use vamp. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 11:38, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Escape Scythe != spike. It's retard spamming for pressure on balled up targets in HA. - 11:44, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
 * pressure is how you win.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] <font color="Black">aesthetic

Haters
seems theres a lot of them

Ive been called a poser & noob because i run this build & my responce Is & will forever be "how bout i go touch ranger instead??"

people seem to be confused about whats good & whats just terrible, a greater majority being more then happy to jump on the hater band wagon - this build is great. its very versatile with a few tweaks. 89.240.49.183 11:28, 3 June 2008 (EDT)


 * Simple fact - overused by people like you. True its good and has its annoyingly defensive benefits but seriously it gets lame when PvP rangers fall into only R/Mo <insert bow elite and mending touch>, R/N (retards) , and R/D (unoriginal at this point). Very similar to the kind of animosity A/W SPs and N/A DD spammers get. Drakemaelstrom 13:20, 6 June 2008 (EDT)
 * This build and other overused builds like it are the reason people say things like "PvX is the worst thing to happen to GW".--99.225.57.217 21:33, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Something called obs mode and sharing/stealing builds. PvX didn't really unleash this on the world, this had to be obsed/stolen from someone on PvX first. - 02:14, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Rawr says he and Skakid invented R/D's D:  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  02:16, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * >:O[[Image:Impossible_Odds.jpg‎|19px]] Frans  02:20, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
 * prolly not.--[[Image:Rebirth Infidel.jpg|21px]] <font color="Black">aesthetic
 * They didn't "invent" it, but Rawr did tell me he used it in TA before Sway or all the other stuff, along with some weird Dervish healer and an Escape Ranger, so all four had a 75% block chance. They got like 60 wins or something... The fact that Skakid's a very strong ranger might have something to do with that aswell.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 01:25, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
 * I've got screens of me running it on february 18th with him, apparently. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 01:28, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Pics or it didn't happen :D  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 01:28, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Sorry, february 16th. See this and this. Check the exif data for the date I made it. And yes, I'm well aware that exif data is easily modified, but I didn't, if my word is of any use. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 01:37, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
 * That Derv build is crazy ;o  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 01:39, 3 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Mmmm i was using this in october, friend was testing as a ganker.--[[Image:Relyk Purifying Veil Sig.jpg|19px]]<font color="99CCFF">R ELYK   <font color="CCCCFF">ʞlɐʇ ʎɯ  00:48, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Antidote Signet
On the main bar.--<font color="99CCFF">R ELYK   <font color="CCCCFF">ʞlɐʇ ʎɯ  00:47, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Wiki ruined another good build...
This build has been around since before the change to Escape. In fact, a different version of this build was posted on www.gameamp.com before the change to escape. Nobody ever really complained about it until it came here. So it seems to me that you guys here at www.pvxwiki.com rip off other sites builds, ridicule them and then say they need to be nerfed. Just fucking stupid if you ask me. -Anonymous
 * sry m8 &mdash;  Skakid  14:54, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * You mean this one? --71.229 15:00, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ mudkip? Misfate  15:26, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ mudkip? &mdash;  Skakid  15:27, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ mudkip? --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  15:28, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ mudkip?  Frosty  No U!  15:32, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ kipmud? God  box    15:34, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * ^mudkip? --[[Image:Dervsig.png]]<font color="DarkBlue">Angelus (<font color="Black"> stalk  | <font color="Black"> contribs ) 15:56, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

I lol'd irl.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  16:20, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Izzyrape
MEans the damage in this build is kind of screwed, time for archive?--<font color=#C68E17>Golden <font color=#C68E17>Star 19:56, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * More than one scythe attack exists. That being said, I dont know enough by memory to suggest a replacement, and Im too lazy to login. Gogey 20:14, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Radiant Scythe, imo. Up to 50 bonus damage.--і†оκαҐυ 20:52, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

ABOUT FUCKING TIME  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  20:48, 10 July 2008 (EDT) ^This Gogey 21:11, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * About fucking time they nerfed SoJ aswell. Brandnew.  21:12, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Now gogo nerf Expertise to disallow Rending Touch spam and we get another HA meta, finally. CV nerf doesn't hurt this very badly tbh.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  21:12, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * *sigh.* nerf expertise AGAIN? Havn't rangers suffered enough yet? Brandnew.  21:15, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * When did they nerf expertise?  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 21:17, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * They nerfed it about eighthundred times already, didn't they? Brandnew.  21:18, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Uh.....no.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 21:20, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Well, at least once, to not make it affect paragon shit. Brandnew.  21:21, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * How did it affect paragon shit? O_o  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 21:21, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Energy reduction on shouts/songs etc. Brandnew.  21:23, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Expertise ever had effect on shouts and chants? Wtf you're lying.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 21:24, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Pretty sure it had. Brandnew.  21:30, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * It only had/s effect on touch skills, attack skills, ranger skills and spirits.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 21:31, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Actually, at first it affected all non-spell skills. Brandnew.  21:33, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * It doesn't now? – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:35, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * No. it now affects:
 * Attack skills
 * Binding Rituals
 * Touch Skills
 * Ranger Skills
 * Brandnew. 21:37, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Meh, glyphs, shouts, what else? It was changed in this update, apparently. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 21:42, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
 * All Rituals, not only Binding Rituals.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 13:03, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

Eremite's HAS to be on the main bar ffs  Frosty  No U!  13:57, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
 * With an activation time of 1 second and the need to have adjacent foes in order to deal significant damage in PvP? Until we're going on an UW farm, sure it's not. Plus, healers hardly mob in one spot. 85.30.220.67 14:23, 11 July 2008 (EDT) ~ Cyber Smoke
 * ^ Lol at that, Quick Attacks own  Frosty  No U!  15:10, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Perhaps you're right here, it still activates faster than the 'no activation time' skills, I'll swap Victorious Sweep for Eremite's. 85.30.220.67 15:25, 11 July 2008 (EDT) ~ Cyber Smoke
 * Aight, basically, it works with the same efficiency as it did before the update now... until they're nerfing another bunch of skills like Pious Assault or Victorious Sweep. We all know this change wasn't about some mysterious "Dervish Spikes". So far, this nerf has created a precedent of having a skill in two different masteries in PvP and PvE, which is rather weird. 85.30.220.67 19:21, 11 July 2008 (EDT) ~ Cyber Smoke
 * ZOMG! It boggles my mind! Get the nerve tonic, hurry! - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]] <font color="#D70000"> sexiness!  19:24, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
 * (ec)I'm pretty sure that Pious Assault will be moved to Earth Prayers. ~ <font color="#444">ĐONT <font color="#444">* <font color="#444">SYSOP  19:24, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Because just removing the DW would be too much goddamn trouble. :< --71.229 19:27, 11 July 2008 (EDT)
 * You know, Dont, I'll whisper only one word on your ear regarding the next possible nerf: "Escape"... =) It's not hard to predict what Izzy does; he's been pretty good at turning stuff the downside in the past. 85.30.220.67 20:45, 11 July 2008 (EDT) ~ Cyber Smoke
 * Well I think Izzy wants rangers to go back to using bows with the usual kebable of Burning Arrow & Cripshot & BHA builds. if not this seems like an awefully mighty good time to get back into touching since they buffed the blood skills theres no reason not to. (yeah I can see a few of you already saying 'you fail gtfo' but its true! touchers have been buffed & seeing as this build has been crippled a little why the fuck not? 89.240.55.132 21:14, 11 July 2008 (EDT)

Izzy quote: "With Rangers using melee weapons, like Thumpers and Escape Scythe Rangers, Rangers finally see some play in PvP" I haven't got a link, but trust me he said it.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  21:07, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

This build
Still works really well. I use my own variant of it that works far better than this version does, and have even managed to solo RA with it (yes, on rare occassions) and bring my whole team back to life. Such an excellent use of expertise! If only there was a decent dagger ranger..oh, and im not posting my variant because PvX swallows builds alive and i don't want it to turn meta. | Intemet  Internet  |  21:13, 13 July 2008 (EDT)
 * "I use my own variant of it that works far better than this version does, and have even managed to solo RA with it" - This is great material for grinch's stupid quotes page. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 22:25, 13 July 2008 (EDT)
 * i dont get it. |  Intemet  Internet  |  19:30, 15 July 2008 (EDT)
 * You soloed RA w/ it? lol  19:46, 15 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Yep. |  Intemet  Internet  |  13:14, 16 July 2008 (EDT)
 * "Solo" being as the rest of my team being dead and every member of the opponent team being alive. And winning. |  Intemet  Internet  |  13:18, 16 July 2008 (EDT)
 * I wish my e-penis what that big Angelic spud 23:11, 16 July 2008 (EDT)
 * sorry, im not too good myself, but my build manages to do everything i need it to do very effectively. |  Intemet  Internet  |  17:44, 17 July 2008 (EDT)

Hint: RA means nothing. Nothing whatsoever. – Ichigo 724  17:49, 17 July 2008 (EDT)

I also would like to know how you managed to get your entire team back to life on an R/D build?:P Ofcourse, unless you brought revive animal and there is an major glitch which I should be abusing by now. Brandnew. 17:59, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * He ment he killed the other team singlehandedly, without any team members.  Frosty  No U!  18:02, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * I know, I'm not an analphabetic, I can read. But try reading his entire comment. Brandnew.  18:04, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * When the enemy team is defeated, your party is revived. I think he meant that "bring the whole team back to life" that way. Or he rezzed someone who rezzed someone etc. ~ <font color="#444">ĐONT <font color="#444">* <font color="#444">SYSOP  18:20, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * sigh* ive done this i believe three times now. The latest was with: me, generic bow ranger, channeling rit(died quickly) and a wammo. they all died, and i was facing a hex necro, a prot monk, a KD warrior and a BA ranger. I killed the necro first, he got rezzed, i killed him again, i killed the wammo, he got rezzed, i killed ranger, then i rezzed my channeling rit and we killed the wammo again and finished off the monk. thats it. All i had to do was not die for about 1 or 2 minutes, then rez the rit. |  Intemet  Internet  |  18:57, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * the fact that i 'soloed' ra was not my point at all; RA is full of noobs. I was just saying that build is still alive and well, it works wonderfully. |  Intemet  Internet  |  19:00, 17 July 2008 (EDT)

Experts
Inferior? Dutchess of Rose aka  lukejohnson  - talk 09:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ lol.  Frosty  No U!  17:59, 12 August 2008 (EDT)
 * I lol'd. God  box    18:24, 12 August 2008 (EDT)
 * ^lol Dutchess of Rose  aka  lukejohnson  - talk 13:10, 13 August 2008 (EDT)
 * lol Angelfire 14:18, 16 December 2008 (EST)

Apply Poison
All teh other guyz r runnin it!!!1!!!1-- R <font color="green" size="1"> e l y k 07:54, 20 August 2008 (EDT)

Oh yah, Archive
Some of this is rly old-- R <font color="green" size="1"> e l y k 07:56, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Not really popular in HA, but still works for most areas. --[[Image:GoD Wario Sig.PNG]]<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 08:02, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Is still completely viable, not as used quite as frequently anymore though. I say keep it in great tbh. Brandnew.  08:03, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Its still as powerful as it ever was. I'm supresied they didn't nerf it, maybe they just figured people would bring stance removal or something.  The only real counters to this counter all other melee builds, the stance removal just isn't enough I guess.  If they'd wanted to nerf it they could have made removing an enchantment mandatory for the deep wound.  70.108.212.124 19:21, 23 October 2008 (EDT)

Derrr the talk page-- Christmas Relyk  18:23, 21 December 2008 (EST)

"If your playing with escape your playing to lose." One of my favorite quotes from some random dead person in RA after this aweful build was the only thing left alive on his team because escape scythe doesn't do **** for damage. It's archive time for this build. (Timcago 22:36, 13 January 2009 (EST)).
 * The problem was actually that you were in RA. It isn't a good measure of a build's effectiveness at all, and just having a scythe@12 = damage (especially on kiters). Btw, Escape isn't just block, it's IMS. Also, Relyk was talking about the talk page. -- Toraen  (Talk  /  Contrib)  23:25, 13 January 2009 (EST)
 * i think this build was originally designed for HA anyways...--72.189.85.14 01:38, 14 January 2009 (EST)
 * No it wasn't--Relyk 09:27, 2 April 2009 (UTC)
 * lol, Sway? Although I think someone from around here used it before it was meta in HA (in TA I think) [[Image:Frostysig9000.jpg|19px]]<font color="Blue">Frosty <font color="Blue"> the <font color="Blue">Admin 11:15, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

banishing strike varient
would be good as varient for AOL(aura of lich) builds ?68.39.180.226 17:30, 28 January 2009 (EST)
 * who runs AoL builds in arenas. Oh yea, bad people. [[Image:Oh noes sig KJ.png]] <small style="font-variant:small-caps"><font face="Aharoni" color="green" variant="small caps">17:39, 28 January 2009 

yeah :P but many ppl in first few arenas, and sumtimes l8r>.> fun to c burning and fucklaod of damage 68.39.180.226 20:51, 29 January 2009 (EST)
 * It's just not worth adding. [[Image:Oh noes sig KJ.png]] <small style="font-variant:small-caps"><font face="Aharoni" color="green" variant="small caps">20:52, 29 January 2009 

Added Spike Variant
Use Lightning Reflexes and then attacks from left to right for a good spike. Use escape when Lightning is recharging or to catch kiting foes. Ermite's attack isn't so good for RA, because rarely do you ever find many foes clumped together. ExiledSoldier 08:31, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Reap Impurities and Irresistible Sweep suck, ermite's is used for it's faster activation. [[Image:Zyke-Sig.png]] 08:35, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * apologies, I should have mentioned that I use this variant in RA where you may need the health buff that reap impurities gives. This wouldn't work in a situation where you know you'll have a healer. ExiledSoldier 09:25, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * thats why u use victorious sweep...--Relyk 00:24, 25 July 2009 (UTC)