User talk:Guild of Deals/PvE Master of Magic

Tried this on my hero and works like a charm. Discuss. --  Guild  of   Deals   12:42, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * This meets enchantment removal...PVE has em too.-- Jjberks 12:47, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * The difference is it isn't like Rend and it isn't as focused. Odds are you'll run into a mob with 1-2 sources of single enchantment removal, max. Odds of it hitting you are slim, and even if it does, it'll hit any other enchantment on you (prots, Orders) or Fire Attunement. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   12:48, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * Soz for my negative attitude... but my last build like this was for pvp and it got trashed... it used chilling winds and freezing gust... it looks pretty good tho... Jjberks 12:50, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * Well, Master of Magic is pretty bad in PvP because 1 source of enchantment removal destroys your entire build completely. For PvE, it's not that bad, as enchantment removal hitting MoM is few and far between. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   12:51, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * ok... i c... hey, could u help me get a sig? i dont know how... Jjberks 12:52, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * Uh...perhaps just Aura of Restoration is a simple enough solution...? seems like an effective cover enchantment.-- Ikimono Thinks before commenting [[Image:Paragon-icon-small.png]] 13:08, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's already in variants. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   13:09, 2 November 2008 (EST)
 * Well then the enchantment removal discussion is finished. If you're in an area that has non discrete enchantment removal, just bring that. Monsters are usually going to try and remove monk enchantments anyways.-- Ikimono Thinks before commenting [[Image:Paragon-icon-small.png]] 13:24, 2 November 2008 (EST)

Looks kinda strong, though did you test this in mesmer heavy areas like say...Garden of Sehborin?(sp) And in HM also? Oh, why would you use a fire ele in an orders team (Just picking holes in your examples of cover enchants.) Morkai 19:45, 5 November 2008 (EST)
 * What does cover enchantments have to do with orders necro? If you don't suck at PvE, you will either have a hybrid monk heal/prot or a heal monk and a prot monk. That prot monk's enchantments, be it SoA, Spirit Bond, Prot spirit, or even RoF will be put on you when you are being attacked and ,therefore, cover your enchantments. J  ustin  6  [[image:Justing6_siggypic.png|19px]] 20:21, 5 November 2008 (EST)
 * Also.. why not bring an orders necro with an ele? You can still have a good balance of physicals and casters. J  ustin  6  [[image:Justing6_siggypic.png|19px]] 20:24, 5 November 2008 (EST)

Dont criticize me for being bad but aura of restoration seems like the best elementalist cover ench here and it heals for a lot with the powerful spells; AoR is typically bad but it works well here. Discuss. -- Jebus  contests  21:34, 5 November 2008 (EST)
 * I don't think its actually a bad idea...long lasting enchant great for cover and can be reapplied easily and it gives you some self-healing. i say main-bar it.-[[Image:Guru.jpg]] 23:11, 5 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's in variants, cover enchants are barely ever needed in PvE and there are other people who heal you.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 02:51, 6 November 2008 (EST)

it's ok but it needs to have a special reason why i would run this over any other damage elite skill. it just doesn't click for the great category.

Fire Attunement
Kind of weird for just 2 spells with a 30 second recharge.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  02:52, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * Optional slot for Rodgort's or such and you'll really need it. Besides, you mave more Fire Magic than anything else. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   06:46, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * Shock Arrow! Obaby. - Misery  Is  Friendly  [[image:Misery Dog obaby.gif|19px]] 06:54, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's in Variants, and Shock Arrow isn't worth it as much without Air Attunement. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   06:55, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * Tbh, I've managed Shatterstone bars with just Glowing Ice and GoLE before Glowing Ice got buffed. You already have GoLE and +2 pips. If you took Rodgort's you would need Fire Attunement, but otherwise, meh. - Misery  Is  Friendly  [[image:Misery Dog obaby.gif|19px]] 06:58, 6 November 2008 (EST)

i know :D use all 4 glowing skills (or to be reasonable, two) then attunements wouldn't be a problem :P 75.105.208.180 11:10, 6 November 2008 (EST)

GoLE
it ends MoM iirc. - Star Seeker  |  My talk  13:45, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * There was an update which made it end on non-elemental skills a while back, just after it was changed, so it doesn't -- Frosty [[Image:Mini england.jpg|19px]] 13:50, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * Okay, neat. - Star Seeker  |  My talk  14:32, 6 November 2008 (EST)

Atts
I would've just left it at 12+1+1 tbh-- Shadow 21:26, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * Meh, other stuff is in the offcase it gets removed in its recharge time. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   21:28, 6 November 2008 (EST)
 * You wouldnt need fire magic then, just a waste to cast ur aoes and energy. Spec it all to earth and water-- Shadow [[Image:Relyk Sig.gif]] 11:06, 7 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's a really insignificant issue. You have more Fire Magic spells than anything else, thus the higher spec. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   11:10, 7 November 2008 (EST)

Enfeebling blood?
You have blurred and wards for anti-melee, but blurred doesn't very long for it's energy cost and Ward vs melee wears off quickly. I say make it E/N with 12+1+1 Energy Storage and 12 curses, and bring enfeebling blood? Jonas 22:51, 14 November 2008 (EST)
 * It will end MoM -- Frosty [[Image:Mini england.jpg|19px]] 22:53, 14 November 2008 (EST)
 * oh, balls. Jonas 22:54, 14 November 2008 (EST)

Un-Updated Master of Magic
master of magic isnt updated. Now it sets all ur elemental attributes to 12 instead of doing what it says on the wiki.--I R oGre 22:51, 16 November 2008 (EST)
 * .....in case you didn't notice, this was made after the update.152.226.7.213 22:53, 16 November 2008 (EST)

Problems I have with Master of Magic
I've a few problems with MoM: A few good things about MoM: So looking at this build I think it doesn't use any of the advantages and most if not all disadvantages I noted. Please don't get me wrong, the build is still good if not great when no enchantment removal exists. In fact, an SF ele will be prety ruined when Fire Attunment is stripped as well...Either way I think this build could have a lot more potential in either direction (with MoM or without...) Shai Meliamne 04:31, 18 November 2008 (EST)
 * It's an elite, so a better elite cannot be taken
 * It's an enchantment and what's more it's probably the most important enchantment evah (except perhaps PS on a 55) - strips make the user nearly entirely useless
 * For as far as it's wanted, a 12/12/12 split can be achieved with attributes and runes alone, so even with three attributes used I think MoM is prety pointless
 * MoM ends on any non elementalist skills, so even cool skills such as a ress cannot be taken. In fact I don't see any use for any secondary skills - except perhaps maintained enchantments.
 * It is a great skill for low level eles. Rewriting this build for lvl 5-15 would make this a great build I think
 * It is also a great skill if you want a lot of points in e-storage and possibly in some other attribute (for instance smiting for SoH) without becoming useless
 * First of all, you shouldnt be seriously PvEing (if there is such a thing) with a low lv char anyway. Second, you can bring a variety of cover enchants like Aura of Restoration, which is great for this build. Third, MoM opens up far more variety than a regular ele, making a secondary profession all but unneeded. Taking heavy fire magic skills while having powerful anti-melee from both water and air magic lines and having a long lasting ward is pretty godly. Fourth, a minor point, higher energy storage makes for more energy. Fifth, if you're achieving 12-12-12-12 in your elemental attribs then you're running way too many runes. One last and somewhat important point, with Master of Magic you can bring Prismatic Insignias that makes your armor pretty godly. -- Jebus  contests  20:34, 18 November 2008 (EST)
 * Lol rw for lvl 5-15-- Shadow [[Image:Relyk Sig.gif]] 21:02, 18 November 2008 (EST)

The Synergy uses are definetly more diverse for the MoM Ele in PvP... at the moment there seem to be more uses in other elites in PvE that just do the job quicker. 211.27.166.180 01:47, 19 November 2008 (EST)
 * MoM is absolutely awful in PvP. Rend it or remove it and youre absolutely useless. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   07:26, 19 November 2008 (EST)

Ever notice that the word useless is being tossed around a lot on this talk page? There really is not a single good idea in this whole build. Your comment about a SF ele being useless without Fire Attun makes me wonder if you've ever played SF ele. Glowing Gaze is gud. This build would do one thing in PvE...create a situation where the AI runs from the two fire magic skills doing about 20-30 damage to one target in total, and the melee characters, while being rendered slightly useless by the easily removable hex (blind is 90% miss chance FYI), are only slightly hindered by the only annoying ward. This all goes to say nothing about the elite that should be dumped in favor of something that will help the party. Boo Hiss Baw. 143.236.35.213 12:51, 23 November 2008 (EST)
 * You're fucking terrible. No additional comment necessary. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   12:52, 23 November 2008 (EST)

Your anger is adorable. Better builds exist. Delete this thing. 143.236.35.213 13:52, 23 November 2008 (EST)
 * What better builds m8? -- Jebus  contests  14:21, 23 November 2008 (EST)
 * @anon: You're fucking terrible. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   14:38, 23 November 2008 (EST)

I was thinking along the lines of any build that either accomplishes something new, or accomplishes an old task in a better way. I dont see any capability for that in this build. You can achieve better results with the old standards. Sure, this may use a new elite, but IMO so what? If you wanna make a melee hate ele, there's better ways. If you want to make a DoTAoE ele (for whatever retarded reason) there's better ways. If you want to make a warder ele, theres better ways. If you want to make an ele that uses more than one attribute, there's better ways. You know, back to the whole reason this wiki exists. But hey, Im just anon. Probably a total noob. Finally, didn't you hear dawg? We're all supposed to get along on the internet. I don't like your build. Theres no reason to let that ruin your week I promise.143.236.35.213 17:51, 23 November 2008 (EST)
 * There are so many things wrong with that argument. DoTAoE is one of the most powerful things to have in PvE. Warder Eles usually dont have 12 earth spec, do they. And the reason that this is good is cause it multitasks and does all of those really well, saving you character slots and adding efficiency. Nobody goes on the internet to get along, they go here to tell others to fuck off. Anons arent always bad, see 71.229 for examples. And the week is over. :P. Anyway, i shall end with reiterating a point made by GoD: You are fucking terrible. Have a nice day. -- Jebus  contests  20:10, 23 November 2008 (EST)
 * "DoTAoE is one of the most powerful things to have in PvE." The only good DoTAoE's are armor ignoring DoTAoE (e.g. SS), and I see necro nowhere in this build.  Elemental AoE's are sooo.. beyond useless in PvE HM.  They do insignificant damage and just cause useless scatter.  They can only be decent if used as a vector for EBSoH.  But even then, SS is better.  --Thc 11:32, 24 November 2008 (EST)
 * My bad, Savannah Heat is bad for DoTAoE. And the only DoTAoE really is Chaos Storm, following traditional lines of DoTAoE. Also, stop making bullshit comparisons, really. SS =/= Ele nukes. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   12:28, 24 November 2008 (EST)
 * ups mistake on my part i meant just AoE sry. cry of pain is hawt. -- Jebus  contests  14:52, 24 November 2008 (EST)

I haven't been here to reply. I have made a list of reasons why and why not to use MoM. A few comments I want to make to Jebus: Edit: About the SF eles, without attunement they are drained from energy prety quickly which equals useless. I agree that it's not completely useless, but I think it's comparable to the usefulness of a MoM based build with MoM stripped... Honestly after I saw this build I've been running a MoM ele and getting both "hate" from the water + earth (wards) lines, damage from the fire line and a good maintained enchantment (SoH) worked for me in those area's. However, I'd suggest to add something like SoH in mainbar; even if it's just to show some of the capabilities of this build: Above average "hate", melee buffs (or whatever) and mediocre damage in one build is not to bad I'd guess. However, MoM in general is bad and should never be brought against to much enchantment removal (for instance Chillblains - which is not to uncommon) Shai Meliamne 20:21, 25 November 2008 (EST)
 * I never intended to play serious PvE with a low level elementalist, just pointing out that that is a great way to use this skill
 * Yes you can bring cover enchantments to reduce the chance of this being stripped, but there still is that fact that IF it is stripped, you ARE useless.
 * Can't say anything about the third comment except 1. you can't use secondary skills except for maintained enchantments and specific toolbox skills (which end MoM) - also who wants to use air? we have Glyph + Steam for better blinds anyway, also use a necro for cracked armor if you need it.
 * E-storage gives higher energy, sure. But is it that useful? Most builds work just as effectively with say 5 e-storage as they would with 15 (30 energy difference) - granted, it is a bonus, but it's definitely not needed.
 * I never said 12-12-12-12 cuz that's useless, I said 12-12-12 if you'd really want 3 elements and that is not to hard to get with runes.
 * Prismatic Insignia. Now we're talking...I'd refer back to the fact that if it's removed...well, than you aint just useless but also weak/dead.
 * There are no eles that dont use attunement-- Shadow [[Image:Relyk Sig.gif]] 18:10, 26 November 2008 (EST)
 * http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:E/Mo_WoH_Water_Runner But I get your point.Pika Fan [[image:lightningbolt_sig.jpg|19x19px]] 18:12, 26 November 2008 (EST)