Archive talk:W/Mo Battle Rage Warrior

Discussion
Right out of my sandbox. [SpNv] ran 2 of these, one with Ex's, one with Wild Blow. - Krowman    11:58, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Yeah, that's where I got these from. Them rolling RenO's faghexway. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 13:30, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Moving to testing. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 13:31, 4 July 2007 (CEST)

I like, I'm thinking a Sword variant wouldn't be too shabby, but a hammer one would be kinda difficult with the loss of Dev Hammer or Backbreaker. Those are my two cents for now, I'll go hop on my warrior and get testing. --Hikari 16:59, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * A hammer variant would be worse than other battle rage builds, in other words, quite bad. If you could use fear me or really any non-attack skill with battle rage, it would be good, maybe. Also, do people even still run Devastating Hammer? I though almost everyone had switched to Earthshaker. --Edru viransu 17:02, 4 July 2007 (CEST)

You can't build up adrenal with Battle Rage since you lose all adrenal once it ends. Mgelo21 19:09, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Use BR to quickly gain adren while it's up. Use EC to charge BR when it's down, and repeat as necessary. - [[Image:Kowal.jpg|15px]] Krowman   23:39, 4 July 2007 (CEST)

[build name="battle rage sword variant" prof=warri/monk swords=12+1+1 streng=12+1 protec=3][sever artery][gash][sun and moon slash][protectors strike][battle rage][enraging charge][mending touch][resurrection signet][/build]

Rather obvious sword variant, I miss the interupt from the axe version though. --Hikari 23:52, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * I'd still prefer the axe. Since BR bars the use of any IAS, you want as many fast-activation skills as you can get. It also does less damage and your DW spam is more costly. And, like you said, the interrupt. - [[Image:Kowal.jpg|15px]] Krowman   23:59, 4 July 2007 (CEST)
 * why is purge signet in the build?-Alpha fireborn 11:19, 5 July 2007 (CEST)
 * To remove everything. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 11:28, 5 July 2007 (CEST)
 * ... Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 02:59, 9 July 2007 (CEST)
 * It's an adrenaline heavy builf, and it has skills to fuel all that adrenaline use. As you can see, only two skills on the bar use energy, and both are intended to fuel increased adrenaline gain. Since you don't really need energy to function here, Purge Signet is a viable choice to remove all hexes and conditions from any character on your team. Very useful against hex stacks: they spend 30e stacking hexes, you remove them all and it hardly costs you a thing (since you don't need the energy anyways). - [[Image:Kowal.jpg|15px]] Krowman    12:28, 5 July 2007 (CEST)
 * I also found it great that both Enraging Charge and Purge Sig have the same recharge time. You can simply Purge Sig, Echarge (when your energy builds up of weapon swapped) and instantly recharge battle rage. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 12:47, 5 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Purge Signet pwns in this build. --74.171.70.24 07:30, 25 July 2007 (CEST)

Shouldn't Critical chop be on the skill bar and protector's as the variant? Considering it's nonconditional +damage, same activation, and possible interrupt?Dark0805|Rant 16:27, 26 July 2007 (CEST)
 * The Downtime is the main key. This build doesn't have IAS, and focuses a lot on spamming its attacks. Since you'll be in BR almost all the time, the conditional aspect of Prot Strike's bonus damage is made more easily achieved. Also, Critical Chop is bad. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:48, 26 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Yes crit chop is bad since nerf. This build pwns. Easily make a pve varient :D. I wonder why no one thought of this build sooner :O. --74.171.70.24 04:35, 27 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Perhaps because they did a long long time ago, but it was never really even remotely viable until battle rage got buffed a couple of months ago, and is still pretty marginal. --Edru viransu //QQ about me 05:13, 27 July 2007 (CEST)
 * I ran something similar, before Nightfalls release, with "For Great Justice!" to start Battle Rage, and Mend Ailment. This is a lot more effective though. Battle Rage has always been a great stance.

Rates
Some rates should be urgently rethinked.There are to many eviscerate fanboys out there ¬_¬ Gilkong 21:30, 15 August 2007 (CEST)
 * No, Eviscerate is fine, it's a great skill. There are too many Hundred Blades fanboys out there though... - [[Image:Kowal.jpg|15px]] Krowman   00:59, 22 August 2007 (CEST)

AB/CM
Why is this listed for AB/CM? Res sig is unnecessary in every aspect in both, as well as neither will you be able to have 100% monk support, without which this build crumples like a paper bag. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ 18:56, 3 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Why do you think you need monk support to spam attack skills? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 05:19, 4 October 2007 (CEST)
 * I imagine this build works like an assassin. Try to kill them quickly and GTFO if you catch aggro. --InternetLOL 05:23, 4 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Unlike most assassin builds this build has no snare, no knockdown, no big frontloaded spike, no teleport, no way to stack up a few nasty degen conditions and run away, no shutdown... You have 1 burst of speed to initially catch a target after which they have 20 seconds to run away which you can do nothing about. Add to that no self heal and you'll just get kited around and killed at range. No one fights a warrior in melee if they can avoid it. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 07:04, 4 October 2007 (CEST)
 * It's a warrior. Warriors don't crumple like paper bags. Unless you kill yourself with empathy/SS/whatever crap people put on you in ABs. Keep in mind, Purge on its own pretty much counters that. Tycn 07:17, 4 October 2007 (CEST)
 * There's a lot of stuff that ignores armor or just stacks up degen quicker than you can pull it off. Though, I think I've been going a little nuts the past few days on warrior builds just because I was encountering a LOT of that stuff. So, for the moment I think I'm a bit biased. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 09:06, 4 October 2007 (CEST)

Well, perhaps there should at least be a note in the variants section to swap out Res Sig for a self heal, either healing sig or a Monk skill, when in AB or CM, as res is useless there, and it's sometimes hard to rely on a monk in those environments. So a self-heal would be much preferrable. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ 22:04, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * We expect readers to be smart enough to do that. But in general, it breaks your chain of attacks. Either way, the logic is there. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:06, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Dying, in general, breaks your chain of attacks, too. Either way, Res Sig is useless in AB/CM. There's no harm in suggesting an alternate skill for AB/CM, since you're listing those are use areas, anyway. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:11, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * That's why you learn not to fight mobs, prekite, kite, and not suck in general. Also, not being a noob and attacking through Empathy/Insidious. But there's Purge Signet for that. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:15, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * So then you generally take a res sig with you to AB/CM? That's your best bet for not sucking? — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:23, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * You didn't even read what I typed. We expect the user to take out the Res sig when they use a specific build in CM. Having to suggest that on every single build listed as CM/AB would, indeed, suck. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:25, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * You're assuming a lot about how I play in AB/CM, as you keep referencing SS and Empathy, neither of which I mentioned. I just mentioned repeated degen and armor-ignoring damage, which could be MANY different skills, not just those two. You also assume I don't know how to kite, pre-kite, or anything else, and you come very close to simply outright personal attacks here. I'm just saying, if you list AB/CM and you have a res sig on, you should at least suggest ONE skill to replace the res for AB/CM. That's like ONE line of text. Unless you have no clue how to type, no, that won't suck much.


 * Honestly, why are you even fighting this? You already agreed the Res should be swapped out for AB/CM, you just don't want to tell anyone on the build page? I mean, are you trying to keep it a secret or something? Or will 1 line of text really consume too much of your precious time...which you're wasting numerous lines of text arguing about... — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:34, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * I couldn't care less about how you in particular play CM. I wasn't referring to you. Again, we expect the reader to be smart enough not to carry a Res Sig into AB/CM. It's that simple. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:37, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Yeah, you can expect the reader to not bring res, but I doubt you can expect every read to make a good decision for what to bring besides res...That's why you suggest something. What it boils down to really, though, is: do you have ANY reason NOT to suggest something as an AB/CM variant? — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:43, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Yeah. Not sucking and not screwing up your combo with a heal that's not even needed. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:44, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * That's why you suggest a skill. If you think a heal's not needed, then suggest something to put in that slot besides a heal. You already said anyone'd be smart enough to drop res sig. So, show us how smart you are and suggest something to put in the hole left by removing res sig. In any case, your argument is repetitive and pointless. Your only reason for not adding the variant is because you don't feel like it, and you like arguing with anything I say. You have no real reason not to add one, or if you do, you seem to be unable to express that opinion. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:49, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * It doesn't matter what it's dropped for. My argument is repetitive because it's simplistic; anyone with a brain can figure out that they should drop a Res Sig for in a build. There's not much to it. If someone needs details on every single skill then they shouldn't be playing GW. If you want to do that so badly, write a guide. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:51, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Perhaps both wikis should be deleted then, as they mainly containg details on every skill and skill combintation. If you really believe what you just said, you therefore admit you shouldn't be playing Guild Wars. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 22:54, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Archive:W/Mo Battle Rage Warrior - 5 attacks isn't ideal but it IS there. Argue less. --Mala[[Image:Mala_sig_Mind_Blast.jpg|19px]] 22:55, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Reithan, I'm starting to think you're trolling with this little series of logical fallacies. --InternetLOL 22:56, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Which ones? Point them out if you think they exist. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 23:02, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * We kinda figured that out yesterday. =P &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:56, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Yeah, well, I wasn't here. Don't take my victory from me. ): --InternetLOL 22:59, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * I just think the reason "I'm not listing a skill swap because it's too much work." is a stupid reason. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 23:02, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * Skill swaps are already there. What is your point? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:04, 8 October 2007 (CEST)

I bring rez into AB/CM because im too fucking lazy to drop it. - Rawrawr  23:05, 8 October 2007 (CEST)


 * It's funny, because that's a better reason to take Res sig than having to take a heal. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:07, 8 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Also, by your logic, Reithan, we should have statements on every build that shouldn't have Divine Spirit saying "don't take divine spirit because it kills your energy, kills your combo, has no bonus effects, and gives +1 to enemies with Shatter Enchantment". &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:08, 8 October 2007 (CEST)
 * No, see, that's a logical fallacy. Just because A != B and A != C does not mean that B != C. I said if you have a slot that SHOULD have a certain skill in certain situations, that should be listed. I never said you should list every skill that you shouldn't put in a slot. Stop being a jackass. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 23:16, 8 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Really? In this case, what are you trying to convince us to take then? &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:53, 8 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Okay, now you're both nitpicking. Reithan, there's no reason to include a variant just for one (out of five) tag, especially when that variant is common knowledge and would hardly cause this build to lose utility even if you did leave the rezsig on. --InternetLOL 23:58, 8 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Yeah, it probably is nitpicking at this point. But I still say that between not including it and including it, including it is the better option. It adds (albeit only slightly) to the build's useage description, and detracts nothing from it. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:01, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Can you please try and answer some of the questions being posed? There are already suggestions for skills that won't kill your combo to replace existing skills. What exactly are you trying to get passed here? Is it "don't be a nub and take Rez Sig in AB"? If so, it's unneeded for the reasons I already stated above. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 00:02, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Which previously asked question would you like answered? I thought I got them all. In any case, to your new question, in a manner of speaking. Though I was thinking something more along the lines of "For AB/CM swap out Res sig for ____" Most people will know to swap out res sig, but you may as well give them quidance as to what to do with that slot. Why not answer MY previous question: "why not?" — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:05, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Because it already gives several suggestions in the variants? --Edru viransu //QQ about me /sysop 00:12, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * "Common attack choices include taking Bull's Strike, Critical Chop, or Wild Blow"
 * I'm not even really sure what that wording means..."common attack choices", that could mean to swap out existing attacks, attack choices you may encounter on other people builds...it's very vague. How about just updating THAT to offer a bit more guidance? — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:14, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Then do it, instead of starting an argument, dodging questions, not knowing what the skills in the build even do(not even knowing that Battle Rage has 33% IMS), etc. --Edru viransu //QQ about me /sysop 00:20, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * I wan't aware that was allowed. And I know what Battle Rage does. Also, I'm still waiting for one of you to point out this invisible question I haven't answered. If it's the meaning of life, I give up. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:23, 9 October 2007 (CEST)

(reset indent) What do you want to suggest putting instead of the res sig? --Edru viransu //QQ about me /sysop 00:26, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * I'm fine with any of the attack choices listed, or possibly some sort of self heal, though self-heal is apparently not 1337, as stated above. — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:29, 9 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Now that's a little verbose, and I think you're just poking fun at me now. Replacing the listed attacks with those somewhat kills it's spike potential, and it seems like purge sig's there for a reason, so why would you replace THOSE with one of those attacks? — ( ɔ \ ʇ ) uɐɥʇıǝɹ [[Image:Reithan_Sig.jpg|19px]] 00:32, 9 October 2007 (CEST)

Purifying and Holy Veils
These two skills are very useful in the Purge Signet slot in RA, AB, and CM. You can precast them so the removal of hexes/conditions doesn't remove Battle Rage. Teutonic 21:44, 19 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Then you lose the benefit of removing a stack of conditions/hexes. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:00, 19 October 2007 (CEST)

Weap Swap
Shouldn't it be mentioned you should use a +5 energy weap, in order to use Enraging Charge right after Purge Signet? I think it's kinda necesary, since it takes a while for a warror to regain 5e.
 * Just switch to a -5e axe before purging. --Mala[[Image:Mala_sig_Mind_Blast.jpg|19px]] 19:21, 16 November 2007 (CET)

Archive
Nerfs on Agonizing, Enraging Charge... &mdash; Rapta   (talk|contribs) 02:04, 1 December 2007 (CET)


 * 1/2 of a second more on one of the skills and the whole build fails?--[[Image:ViYsig5.jpg|19px]]<font color="Darkblue">Victoryisyours (<font color="Darkblue">talk /<font color="Black">pvxcontribs ) 23:24, 1 December 2007 (CET)
 * Yeah. It was designed around spiking with Dismember + Agonizing + Exec. without need for IAS. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:31, 1 December 2007 (CET)

Put it back in, it still works fine.--71.67.243.230 23:03, 27 May 2008 (EDT)
 * I agree, this is still quite viable. Dutchess of Rose  aka  lukejohnson  - talk - Contributions 06:30, 28 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Yup, I don't see why a tiny cast time nerf destroys the build. [[Image:EkkoWord.jpg|50x19px]]<font color="Black">Ekko <font color="Black">(Brother  <font color="Black">Starr)  10:29, 28 May 2008 (EDT)

"For Great Justice!"
You could throw that in (instead of Enraging Charge, most likely), and unarchive this. "For Great Justice!" just had a change in functionality for PvP, and now works with skills like Battle Rage and Focused Anger. -Mike 18:37, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Hmm, 3 adrenaline per hit sounds nice. / Fros  T  alk  \ 18:40, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Damn, I thought Battle Rage would double "For Great Justice!"'s gain like Focused Anger. Either way, it's still good. >.> -Mike 18:51, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Oh, if it does that then that is epic, 4 adrenaline per hit >.> / Fros  T  alk  \ 18:55, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Ahh no it will be 3, Battle Rage only effects Attacks, still, 3 adrenaline per attack. / Fros  T  alk  \ 18:55, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Oh well, I'm still having fun with . -Mike 19:01, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I've put a build similar to this into testing now. tis best buidl with enraged charge i csan see. Dutchess of Rose  aka  lukejohnson  - talk - Contributions 12:34, 20 June 2008 (EDT)