Archive talk:Rt/Mo Warmonger's Support/Archive 0

Wins battles, tbh. 23:55, 5 January 2008 (EST)
 * I would rather use spirit of life... Eases the pressure sometimes as an mass AOE heal. Alpinista 02:36, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Bloodsong fucks with people, but the shoreter recharge may be nice to counter heavy spirit raeping.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 10:03, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Life has drawbacks, because you've gotta lay it down every time it dies. [[Image:Shogunshen_Sig.jpg|19px]] Shen (contribs) 10:10, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Bloodsong lives for forever and heals itself. - Rawrawr  10:11, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * You essentialybeat me to correcting myself, rawr.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 13:10, 6 January 2008 (EST)

Make channeling 13, restoration 14. You aren't meeting any breakpoints as is.  Shen (contribs) 10:11, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Resto makes hardly any difference, and with channeling your bloodsong is more beefy to kill (still lol wand though) and AR does a little extra. - Rawrawr  10:18, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * You spam Spirit Light and Mend Body and Soul much more often than AR. Seems I had it wrong, 14 is breakpoint for Bloodsong. But If someone is going to target Bloodsong, one extra level won't do anything. [[Image:Shogunshen_Sig.jpg|19px]] Shen (contribs) 10:20, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Extra 10 armor I think. You could always go 12+1 resto, 11+1+1 channeling, and the rest in spawning for longer warmongers though. - Rawrawr  10:22, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * Tru tru, and that might warrant a minor rune. I do a preview of that to see the changes in numbers.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 13:10, 6 January 2008 (EST)
 * (changes made)Excellent idea, rawr. 1.2 more seconds of warmonger's for -10 health(i.e. the minor rune) and like 2 less rage damage. Bloodsong is sturdy enough as it is, imo.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 13:16, 6 January 2008 (EST)

WELL?
Please, check builds before submit a new one. Note that this build is a dupe of http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Rt/any_Warmonger%27s_Supporter (Check Variants Section build and History). I see even it is in Featured Builds. Builds not following WELL policy should not be in this template. Propose apply WELL tag. 84.77.31.139 10:36, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Apart from that one's main bar is shit. - Rawrawr  10:48, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Ntm i dont think well is applicable to untested builds. either way this one is better. that build has 13 channelign and no ancestors, and uses shit like life and ghost mirror light instead of the sort of utility that wins games(veil/AoS).[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 11:50, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * It doesnt run 14 channeling for splinter breakpoint? o my lolol - Rawrawr  11:52, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * WELL is applicable to Testing Builds. If one build is better than other is decided by the Community. The community is vetting and up to now, http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Rt/any_Warmonger%27s_Supporter shows better vetting results than this one. Moreover, Ancestor's Rage was already set as Offensive Variant. I see a clear WELL tag, only because of DUPE. You are free to modify, add and improve original build. Chuki 11:59, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Time to vote on both those to change that tbh. - Rawrawr  12:01, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * (edit conflict ftw cuz its someone supporting me)yours has been around longer, and i've just ion the last minute petitioned to have bobs bullshti vote removed. moreover, variants is not the build. your the one should be improving, tbh.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 12:02, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * I fail to see how 2 skills is the difference between a 5-5-5 and a 3-2-2, really. Although that one needs to lose ghostmirror for ancestor's, this one is more easily fucked over with only one spirit. --Mala[[Image:Mala_sig_Mind_Blast.jpg|19px]] 12:40, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * It smells like.... snif.. snif.... WELL spirit.... Please, don't forget this is not a competition. It is a wiki. Respect Policies and contribute to construct84.77.33.240 12:45, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * I chose between the main bars. Without hex removal and AR, the rit is almost pointless, giving it a 3-2-2. However with the bars it becomes the meta TA rit build (although veil is normally subbed for remove) and therefore is a 5-5-5. - Rawrawr  13:01, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Exactly. the build that contains the spirit of the meta is the superior build. optional is a great way for WELL nazis to plaster that template everywhere, but it is not the build. in addition, mala:life dies every 20 seconds, not much help.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 13:02, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * tbh del other build (even though it was first) add the skills it has into variants. We want the best build not the first, and this got indeed rated higher. Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (contributions  * sandbox ) 10:23, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * HOW IS THIS A HARD TO FIT IN BUILD? - Rawrawr  13:18, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Refering to my vote? Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (contributions  * sandbox ) 13:33, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * And bobs iirc. - Rawrawr  13:34, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Ah. Killing bsong cripples this build essencially (slight, mbas, oos) and thus is best paired with another spirit abuser. Bob's is just wrong tbh. Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (contributions  * sandbox ) 13:42, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * Re:Bobs vote. i put it on the notice board, hopefully they will remove.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 13:47, 7 January 2008 (EST)

er
Lose holy veil, add splinter, add GvG tag Himynameisbobbyjoe 14:07, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * This is a fucking 4v4 build. - Rawrawr  14:10, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * There's no point in running a rit midliner in GvG(unless they're running some really weird rt/mo smiting+channeling+resto+communing build or just weapon of fury(not really something I'd advise but more frenzy and more bull's is kinda nice)). That's what your runner and/or random midliner you stick splinter+ancestor's on is for. --&mdash; Edru / QQ  15:07, 7 January 2008 (EST)
 * rawr gets the point across.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 09:33, 8 January 2008 (EST)

Death Pact Signet
For realz? Come on now.. In small PvP, someone's bound to see that going off and call it out. It's like saying "Hey, buy one get one free right there! Plus, he's already 15% off!" I'd rather see Rez Sig there, or at least FoMF. cedave (contributions_buildpage)  16:18, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * If I see FomF start casting, I'm going to either interrupt or focus all the damage I can on the fomf guy for those 4 seconds and either kill him before it finishes or just after. If fomf goes off, the ressed guy is probably very low health, because the enemy team will pressure anyone with fomf so they res people with low health. &mdash; Edru / QQ  16:31, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * One guy at 100% and one guy at 85% >>>> one guy at 50% and one guy at 42.5% --71.229 16:37, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Or you could just take Rez Sig and have one guy at 100% who isn't death-linked to the guy at 85%, although who won't have full energy. [[Image:Cedave_bad.png|16px]] cedave (contributions_buildpage)  16:41, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Why are you letting a guy who got ressed with death pact die again? Pretty sure you've got a woh/zb monk and a secondary healer(this rit) to prot them and heal them up if the prot gets removed. As well, with a monk and a rit with mbas and spirit light, why is your death pact guy at 85%? &mdash; Edru / QQ  16:47, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * (EC)DPS is good because 2-3 guys at 100% health and high energy, with the rezzer not spending any energy or health>>>1 guy with 100% health and 25% energy, even if his life isn't linked to the rezzer. Small arena battles are often very short and somewhat fast paced, so getting your key teammates up as fast and powerful as you can is vital.  FoMF is fine in large arenas because of 2+healers being able to stop spikes on the rezzer and the rezzee far easier than a single monk and an off-healer w/o real prots.  It can have the effect of killing you when you otherwise would have been fine, but it saves your team more often than it pwns it.  Oh, and 2 second cast ftw. Dejh 16:51, 8 January 2008 (EST)

AoE or party pressure doesn't dominate TA like it does in HA (Fire AoE, Tainters, etc, etc) thus most of the time the one dying will be the only one not at ~100%, so DPS is way better than FomF. Swiftslash \\  (contributions  * sandbox ) 16:57, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * My biggest problem is the RA tag. Death Pact in RA is suicide. Like.. ubersuicide. Monks aren't super-common, and if you can't keep the guy alive yourself, you're screwed. Anally. [[Image:Cedave_bad.png|16px]] cedave (contributions_buildpage)  16:58, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Also, according to something I saw somewhere on here, Assume bad party members and good opponents. I think this goes especially for RA. [[Image:Cedave_bad.png|16px]] cedave (contributions_buildpage)  16:59, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Mighta been Scottie's user page. But RA is RA. [[Image:Shogunshen_Sig.jpg|19px]] Shen (contribs) 17:00, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Shrug*. EIther you have no monk so you might as well die. Or you have a monk who either died (then he'll appreciate the extra energy) or he let someone die (in which case he's a scrub so you could just resign anyways). EIther way FomF is in variants no? Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 17:01, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * EDIT CONFLICT: Good opponents in RA? You need a new perspective at life. Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 17:01, 8 January 2008 (EST)

(reset) Nonetheless, if you expect to be using Death Pact in RA and not be committing suicide in the act, then you need to /resign, QQ, and stop playing RA. Death Pact is fine for TA, but RA it's fail. <font color="#AA226D" face="times new roman" size="2">cedave <small color="#AA226D">(contributions_buildpage)  17:10, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * It specifically says that using res sig is better in RA. &mdash; Edru / QQ  17:13, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * (delayed response) The rezzee is at 85% because of DP. --71.229 17:16, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * Kk. Sorry. Didn't read that far down. Why if FoMF a variant, too? I thought we'd concluded it was fail. [[Image:Cedave_bad.png|16px]] <font color="#AA226D" face="times new roman" size="2">cedave <small color="#AA226D">(contributions_buildpage)  17:16, 8 January 2008 (EST)

Btw. Edru, mind chiming in on the current fragfest going on in the A.N.? It's the only Build Conflict that's over a page long. Should be obvious. <font color="#AA226D" face="times new roman" size="2">cedave <small color="#AA226D">(contributions_buildpage)  17:17, 8 January 2008 (EST)

FomF is variant bc some ppl like FomF and it's suited for some teams (teams with 3 healhybrids and such). Swiftslash \\  (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 17:20, 8 January 2008 (EST)

@DPS argument. I have DPS in the main bar because i care more about TA than RA. I leave a somewhat indepth mention of the advantage of res sig in RA. I put in FoMF because there are many, many people who are total pussies. 18:31, 8 January 2008 (EST)
 * DPS is like a 2 for one sale on scrubs for any good player.-- Shadow sin  10:30, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * So don't be a scrub?[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 10:32, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * DPS owns, becuase it's no cost, fast cast, short rc and alot of H and E given to the ressed one. The downside is only a prob if your team is really bad, in which case DPS vs ressig doesn't really matter. Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 10:33, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * In 4v4 its hilariously powerful.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 10:38, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * Until the other team notices.-- Shadow sin  11:17, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * ...[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 11:38, 9 January 2008 (EST)

merge
Merge is fine considering current state, i have this to say: Otherwise? go crazy, ich. 10:32, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * My build carrys the spirit of the meta, no question.
 * So my build name stays.

Rt/Mo is how this is played so that is what should be standard IMO. Swiftslash \\  (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 10:34, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * Which is why my build's name stays.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 10:38, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * I'm tempted to move it to a third name all together just so the QQ will end. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 10:39, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * IMO it should be OoS TA Support Ritualist Person With Holy Veil. OoS Hybrid Support is a good name though, it's a supporter, both offensivly and defensivly (in case anyone missed that ^^) Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (<font color="Black">contributions  * sandbox ) 10:50, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * TBH Chukis build was here first and your dube has no right to keep its name.-- Shadow sin  11:11, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * Ffs shadowsin. They arent fucking dupes. - Rawrawr  11:14, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * Oh no? 6 matching skills not counting the res. one skill difference that depends on party/player preference. if they are merging that means they are Dupes no?-- Shadow sin  11:15, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * /sigh... - Rawrawr  11:25, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * Although the build I submitted was first I suggest to end Discussion a name as Warmonger's Hybrid OoS Support    or     OoS Warmonger's Hybrid     or    Hybrid Warmonger's Support. It is not my build (as other can thinks about build that have submitted) so I let well Ichigo, well the community to support this naming proposition. Thanks. Chuki 11:24, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * If thats alright with you, then I dont object.-- Shadow sin  11:32, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * A new name would be best. as you will, ichigo, or whoever.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 11:38, 9 January 2008 (EST)
 * I have of course my own opinion, but also I think we all have to yield (¿? sorry for my poor english) to end discussion. I, of course, demand all parts to yield. Ok, of course, also, to Dark's proposal. Btw, Dark, thanks for your note at my (yes, this mine ;-) ) talk page. I will answer it at your site tonight. Chuki 11:52, 9 January 2008 (EST)