Archive talk:Team - Underworld Speed Clear/Archive 2

vale A/N vs. vale A/E
First of all, before any discussion, I'd like to say that both work and take about the same time, and is mostly preference. However, I think A/N is slightly safer (and yes, I have tried both). A/E requires the spirits to target you to do much damage, which doesn't always happen at the first and second mob, even if you are standing right in the middle of where they spawn. If you can't do much damage, then you run the risk of spirits dying, and therefore failing. Chillblains on a necro works, but it is hard on energy, believe it or not. With A/N, you can use chillbs on recharge no problem, thus, freeing up a slot on the necro's bar so he can take stuff like EVAS, BuH! etc. to kill even faster.

Also, at least with pugs, A/N is much, much more common. If anything, they should both be listed as "Variants", instead of saying that the A/E is the standard build. --User: Thc 21:54, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
 * PS - also the attributes on the A/N were off. --User: Thc 21:56, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Mountains perma
Is there any way to run the mountains perma as E/A?
 * Only with golden eggs and candy corn, and even then it's harder than with a/e, because you'll only have 15 SA (I believe). -- Star of Exile  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk   21:55, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Good to see it
Good to see folks have made use of parts of my original guide, which is now a bit outdated. (Gerg)
 * wut -- Star of Exile  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk   21:07, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Vale Idea's?
Dwarven Stability and Dark escape on the Sin mean that he only takes 1 dmg from IW, makes it easyer on energy too. Elegent 13:20, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

- lol? how Dwarven Stability is reducing the damage you take? and Dark Escape? Meaning you wait for necro to kill the bad guys? lol. Any more bright ideas you have?
 * Dwarven Stability would allow you to nearly maintain Dark Escape (you also have consets reducing the recharge), which doesn't end on sliver armor's or aftershock's damage, just when you physically attack. All of the skills on that bar look too important though. And there is a portion where you need to wand for Shadow Refuge's healing bonus. Toraen 15:58, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

If you guys want vale done withen 9 mins u need 3 things. a Pro Chambers, Vale necro and Vale Sin. im not going to give any of the builds cause we hold the record of doing uwsc in 7 mins Sry^ ^

if anyone wants to pm me in game to come on a run you can.....u musty do areas fast.......<>xx Silents death xx

you cant do vale in 7 minutes,max is probably 9... the fastest run i have ever seen is 10 minutes of course this is post nerf,so which ever way it is you are talking bullshit

plains counters
should signet of humility be mentioned in the counters section of the plains-sin part? 85.165.253.129 23:32, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I put it in. Arnout aka The Emperors Angel 12:21, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Which is easiest?
Which build is..

Easiest to get skills for Easiest to do - safest/less work/less chance to die

And could you also tell me the hardest? :D! (Based on the same things)

Thx ^_^


 * Easiest is probably chamber, waste or pits (i started as chamber), hardest is mnt imo -- Star of Exile  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk   15:27, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Hardest is probably mnt, although really not that hard. Hardest to get skills for is either pits for derv skills, wastes/pools for rad field, or mnts/wastes/plains for BUH! Easiest area is pits, just roll an A/D and maintain SF and kill threshers first and you can't die.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 15:39, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * collectors first -- Star of Exile  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk   16:31, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Threshers.... Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 17:54, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Lolz. Wich spawn minions? Kill those first. Arnout aka The Emperors Angel 11:01, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Wiki says collectors (Though you shouldn't kill them first as then the minions become hostile to the threshers and you get FoCed). I just c-space spam and not had a problem yet. Andy 12:33, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Ofcourse you kill the minions as soon as they spawn, you wouln't want to get any rampant minions on your head. Arnout aka The Emperors Angel 14:53, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * And nice damage off banishing. Andy 15:03, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * If you kill the threshers first, and do a decent job pulling, there's nothing for the minions to go hostile on. By the time threshers are dead, you have multiple minions to go AoE Holy rape on. Killing collectors first makes no sense.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 15:58, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * You kill collectors first so that they don't spawn minions from the dead threshers, it's very simple. If they spawn minions, it's slower because you have to take the time to kill the minions and be careful not to kill the collector before the minion -- Star of Exile  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk  16:08, 8 April 2009 (UTC)
 * You don't get it. If all the threshers are dead, minions don't mean shit. Blow up the minions in one attack, hit the collectors with the AoE and start killing the collectors.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 16:15, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

anyways, pits and chamber is easyRiktw 12:53, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
 * You guys all fail. Life, you fail most of all.  Threshers first is safer but slower.  You kill collectors first so they don't heal everything with wells.  You either ignore minions or dc somewhere else and let threshers kill them. And you call others bad lol.  Ur so terrible. --75.95.205.187 17:35, September 11, 2009 (UTC)

Weapons?
I currently use a Droknar's staff, which as all the mods required for a sin to wrok.l The only thing is, I just read i need a shield with +10 fire AL. Is this true? Doesn't Shadowform stop them from attacking? =s! Thanks.
 * I assume you're doing waste - it's to reduce damage against zealot's fire -- Star  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk   01:16, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
 * The shield+caster weapon set is just to make things easier. You'll take less damage from zealots fire if you use a fire shield, but it's no big deal if you don't have one.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 01:54, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
 * So what weapons would be suggested for shield+caster, what greens/golds should i aim for =] thanks 93.97.250.47 02:13, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Any 16AL shield with +10 vs fire. +45 hp while enchanted is nice as well. The sword/axe/spear should be +5 energy with +20% enchantments. Not sure on green shields, but if you'd prefer a green weapon; rajazans fervor, totem axe, and spirit of the forgotten all have those stats.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 04:20, 10 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Forgotten shields from the end NF chests have +10vs. cold/fire etc. But personally I use a caster melee weap with a earth focus(destroyer) with +45 while enched and a +10 vs. fire inscrip. --Sam6555 15:09, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I have a +10al vs shock & fire (and +5, 20% spear), - I use one in every area whether its needed or not - if I'm low on energy and need to use SF, I swop to an Earth staff for extra energy, and can then wand stuffs if I want more damage. Andy 15:19, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Always keep my zealous scythe and daggers on me also. Even if I don't need the energy the extra 30 damage (3x10) does help a little I guess. --Sam6555 15:21, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

variants
i think all the variant builds need their own section, rather than in subsections. its pretty clogged up and would be nice to see it a little neater. this article is massive :O--Relyk 06:59, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

MORE ECTOZZZ?
Which of the runs nets an average of more ectos. I've been switching between plains,pools and pits and never seem to get enough feedback to say that one is more profitable. I think pits dont have as much ecto drop chances as the plains/pools, but I certainly cannot decide which one of the latter is more profitable. Greed FTW. &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 62.235.194.51 (talk &bull; contribs).
 * I believe you get most ectozzzzzzzzzzzzzz from the plains run, I am not sure though ;o Brandnew 11:53, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Plains or wastes I guess, dunno. Andy 13:30, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Plains, because when you're done you can go farm mindblades for fun. -- Star  [[Image:Star star 2.png|19px]]  talk  </b> 14:57, 14 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Definitely plains, but only because 90% of pools pugs are epic fail. Most of the time I can finish two riders+spawns before pools is ready for 4H.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 02:36, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

on pits i get a nice amoth of ecto, mostly 2 or 3 from dropsRiktw 12:53, 30 April 2009 (UTC) IT doesnt matter what area u do. iv done over 1000 runs. i run everything..... its all Chance....Xx Silents Death Xx

RoJ Vale Variant - Demonstration link?
I was just having a look at the RoJ Vale Variant toward the bottom of the page. The first bullet point under "Usage" says "Excellent Demonstration with the RoJ Monk" but the link doesn't seem to go anywhere. Is anyone else having this problem?--90.193.106.87 16:34, 21 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I am too... 70.152.219.17 23:43, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Can someone remove the meta tag?
This build isnt meta, this is just a good build for uw clearing just as any other build. I request that the meta tag be removed due to the fact taht nnoone can explain why this build is considered meta. (compare this build to 600/smite or 55/ss or any other random uw group)
 * it is meta because everone alot of people runs it in UW mister anonimious. <font color="Orange">Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig.png|User:Fox007]] 12:18, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

are you insane ? not everyone use this to farm uw .. I use 600/smite alot and 55/ss aswell as a normal group, this statement of yours should be removed Fox007.
 * Don't forget to sign....they aren't saying this is the only build that works...just the best....hence META.[[Image:Xtreme Hunter.png]] 12:35, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Happy mister Anon. <font color="Orange">Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig.png|User:Fox007]] 13:10, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * yes thank you.. "Anon delivers"
 * Its not the best. It's a guide for people new to the most commonly used uw farm build.
 * Anon is awful. Gtfo.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 15:16, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks life. Forgetting to sign wins. Andy 15:20, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Now I'm confused. That comment was directed at the original anon btw. Dunno If it was you.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 15:39, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
 * This is the best, fastest build to clear UW on HM, used by the greatest number of successful groups. It is clearly meta. 68.51.95.206 04:49, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * It's actually not the fastest.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 05:01, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * What is the fastest? 600?[[Image:Xtreme Hunter.png]] 10:43, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Never, unless u run 4 x 600 teams, and even then, it wouldn't be faster... The UWSC Sin team is designed to do all the quests at the same time, thus finishing in the fastest possible time... I too, Life, would like to know what's fastest...Anwyn 11:09, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Same concept, slightly different builds and technique for vale & chamber are the only differences as far as I know. The builds here are aimed more at safety than speed, as the people looking for them here will be completely new to UW. Andy 15:31, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Well isn't that what the "Variants" section is for?[[Image:Xtreme Hunter.png]] 15:55, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * As Andy said, different vale and chamber, as well as Eles in place of sins and a Mesmer in pits. ONI summoning stones in vale too.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 17:39, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Every time I go to ToA, 70% of the people there are looking for more people who can run THIS build or a build very similar to it. The other 30% are either looking for a farming partner for duo farming, setting up an FoW run, or are trying to sell/buy stuff. In my very humble opinion, this is meta. If you don't like that, cry moar Q.Q Skie M 17:41, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * @Life I know what you are saying but can't we just list that under vairants like "RoJ Vale Variant"? tbh the others are critical to the run.[[Image:Xtreme Hunter.png]] 18:12, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Nah, those variants shouldn't be listed, as they are purely for a speed run. In a pug, the chance of failing means you're going to waste a lot of money on personal cons. Perhaps a note at the top/bottom. @Skie, we are well past that topic.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 18:19, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Hmm, the elite meta builds are not consistent then. At least Urgoz and Deep are builds for extremely speedy runs that aren't really pug friendly - but I have seen pugs in Urgoz use consist inferior builds (grasping earth on sin, succor on bonder etc). UW seems the opposite, and FoW and DoA are sitting on the fence. Athrun Feya 22:03, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * UW is much easier than Urgoz, Deep and is done more by pugs. The reason these builds are "pug friendly" is because they are lol easy. The variants that Life is talking about are just for record runs,and are only used by Guild groups, pugs dont use them because they would fail and also because pugs cant get a record anyways.  Fawx [[Image:FawxSig.gif]] 06:37, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I disagree, I think its easier for someone clueless to pug Urgoz than UW. UW is done by more pugs because its shorter and has better reward. My point was that some other elite area builds could be, but are not currently, loleasy pug-proof (deep and urgoz specifically). Do we want the optimum builds for elites on PvX or something that is safest for PuGs? Athrun Feya 15:17, 10 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I think the PuG-safe builds should be on here, maybe with a mention somewhere of the record-holding build (a subpage maybe?) since we are supposed to document builds. The PvE GW elites probably don't use PvXwiki as a reference. Toraen   talk  22:46, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Maybe something like the DoA cryway build? Have the slow build at the top, and the speed/record holding at the bottom?  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 22:56, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I disagree, UWSC fails often enough with pugs - if you get them trying to run harder builds with higher fail rate, the average pug run will get even worse. If your good enough, you will be recognised and invited to better runs by people who already know the faster tactics. Andy 23:04, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Both the safer and speedier builds will be available, and we're not trying to get pugs to run harder builds. PvXwiki really should document the fastest builds somewhere. At the bottom of the page might not be the best idea though; these articles are already kinda long and people are easily confused. Toraen   talk  23:11, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I didnt mean have them run eles or anything. Just have a safer, albeit slower, build on top, and a faster build for people that know what theyre doing.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 23:12, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Lolz, that won't do anything. The PUG's will then start to ask for the better, faster build, and even more runs will fail. Arnout aka The Emperors Angel 09:38, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
 * change it to the fastest build imo. that way pugs are forced to improve in skill and capability.
 * It also means people would have to bring personal cons, which most people cbf to do in a pug because, well, it's fucking retarded to do so because it's a pug. ··· Danny   Does   Drugs  14:51, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * To be fair, the higher fail rates mean longer runs when countering in fails. So for PUGs the easier builds will often be the fastest. Not trying to say that logic holds much water in any other situations, and yeah the fastest build should probably be up, but put them together; this build isn't meta because it's the fastest or the best, just because its permeated into PUG play. --86.20.30.182 11:15, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

Typo
Ctrl+F Grapsing 75.42.238.253 04:41, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed Tjubutsi 14:37, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

Vale Necro
Shouldn't the extra points be put towards blood magic to make awaken the blood last a bit longer? k thx bye. 69.113.47.166 01:05, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think many people use AtB anyway when they play N/Rt, I for one don't use it. --Sam6555 14:45, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Mainbar "BUH!" imo. Things die in about 10 seconds anyway, and makes SS hit almost 50. Andy 23:17, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The only things you really "need" are SS, spirit, AR, splinter weapon and FomF. Everything else is optional.  --75.95.209.103 21:56, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

Better mountains walkthru plz
On mnt theres sometimes a really crappy spawn where theres 5 or 6 behemoths on top of each other... how do you kill em like this?Generalmurgahn 03:27, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Learn the pattern of healing springs, and switch targets accordingly. 6 stack is mounts hell though. Usually you'll break through eventually.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 03:38, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * people say this all the time: learn the pattern. What specifically IS the pattern though? thanksGeneralmurgahn 21:27, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
 * It depends on the spawn. There's a pattern in which they use it so theres always one going. If you watch and switch targets correctly, they should rarely get a healing spring off.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 23:05, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Mesmer chamber
Is it possible? Considering the use of essence I'd think it would be maintainable at 12. Or do I need candy? -- <font color="Black">Karasu (talk) 14:17, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * You need corn+egg to maintain.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 16:00, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

MONEY??
how much? Wuhy 23:20, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
 * How much do you make per run? Depends on ecto drops. If every run is successful, then you get 1 ecto a run.  00:37, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd be more curious about the golds from endchest... i checked it on wiki and only eblade worths something... - Wuhy  [[Image:User_Wuhy_sig.jpg|18px]] 23:37, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Only eblades and compasses really. You generally hope for a double ecto at chest.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 23:50, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

uhh...
There is a line, during the description of the mountains 'sin, that says "use your aggro to kill them." huh? Is your aggro-bubble somehow deadlier than mine? Cause thats no fair. I keep having to use skills to kill stuff.
 * Sliver Armor uses agro to kill... Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 16:17, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Air of Superiority
Sucks penis. Take Strength Of Honor, +28dmg a hit is good.--67.240.81.210 21:49, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

CoP nerf
yeah, i say replace CoP with light of deldrimor for chamber sin. First of all, CoP is needed for ranged killing the terrorwebs. Second of all CoP actually does MORE damage for a single person using it now.--Xutar 20:09, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

explain how it does more damage that makes no sense... unless your talking about degen....66.58.179.251 22:02, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Degen damage exceeds original damage.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 22:07, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
 * But degen is already maxed out from EN & Rad field. Still outdamages due to LOD's big recharge. Andy 00:18, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
 * With LOD variant my time was 2 mins worse from 15 to 17 mins, but i have a low dvelver rank though.konserv 09:33, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

and what about the RoJ monk as RoJ scatters now?
 * Rit with painful bond or SS nec. (edit) wtf, if pulled right mobs won't scatter even if hit by AoE, RoJ stays. --Anonimous. D: 16:51, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

I use LoD myself instead of CoP, works better for me. I also use Viper's Defenses as anti-bodyblock instead of Death's Charge, extra degen + being able to escape from vengeful aatxes = win imo. Poison makes up for the degen lost from CoP 84.24.37.134 10:50, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Vale Rit
[build prof=Rt/Mo Channeling=12+1+3+1][signet of spirits][painful bond][summon spirits][by ural's hammer][splinter weapon][ancestor's rage][spirit rift][rebirth][/build]

Anon goes theorycraft. --Anonimous. D: 11:53, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Hawt splinter is hawt, but not enough aoe damage to kill aatxe and graspings (quickly/effectively) before the quests. Andy 12:17, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Thoguh PB deals aoe damage, it doesn't so this doesn't really work as I wanted it to. :P --Anonimous. D: 13:49, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * PB is an aoe hex, but the damage is only done to the enemy hit by a spirit. Andy 15:02, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
 * it's not an aoe hex either. Sir Nothing 00:39, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * oh nvm! i never knew it was a aoe hex! just looked at it. probably cuz i usually just use it against single bosses. my bad. Sir Nothing 00:40, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

So this does work?? I won't waste my time creating a ritualist, getting it up there and get called a noob? Have you tried it?

Pits
I added the A/N variant to the pits section. Urafailure91 21:15, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Plains doing 4 Horseman solo
Plains Sin: " (...) You job is mostly utility, and you won't be able to do The Four Horsemen quest alone. " This is not a 100% true. I got a plains sin who did 4H all by himself. Unfortunately I wasn't in plains to see how he did it but i'll try to get some more info on this. --Johnny rodrigues 23:18, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Would be very nice for me to know how to do 4h solo, i'm always waiting around for pools to finish his job before I can do anything. --Sam6555 12:29, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Probably best to keep this off here - I'm sure everybody will love it when every other run is failed by some shitter trying to do 4h solo because they saw it on pvx. Andy 14:35, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yea good idea....I know what skill is used, but have no clue of how to use it to do it solo. --Sam6555 16:40, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Here is me having done 4h solo

--FluffyFTW
 * And here's a link to a tutorial . Should I post this on the build page? --FluffyFTW
 * No ty, we don't want random pugs doing this. :) --Sam6555 11:55, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Removing RoJ
Do you think we need to remove RoJ now...since RoJ now causes scattering...and not much groups use it? 24.16.99.43 01:29, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree. No one uses RoJ anymore, just N/Rt vale supports.

removed it Riktw 22:07, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

A/Me Pits Varient
I've tested the A/Me Pits Varient and it seems to work faster than A/D and A/E, but I just have one question about it. Do you guys echo Light of Deldrimor or Radiation Field? I've asked around and I'm getting mixed answers so if anyone knows which is better, please reply. ^^ AtomiK 04:52, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Probably LoD.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 04:58, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, CoP should probably be in the place of echo.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 05:02, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Really? I figure echoing LoD has a better damage output that using CoP with LoD. AtomiK 17:34, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, CoP's degen means that theyre degen is always maxed, giving it decent damage output as well as helping against scatter. Personal preference tbh.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 19:49, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
 * CoP is better. I can clear pits and start quest by 9 min. This is usually before wastes starts his quest.

Rt/N Vale Variant
[build prof=Rt/N Communing=12+1+3 curses=12 spawning=3+1][spiteful spirit][great dwarf weapon][pain][vampirism][disenchantment][anguish][summon spirits][flesh of my flesh][/build]

I saw a guy run this successfully. Comment please. :) Mathias Cali 04:42, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Could be good to take some kind of spirit moving skill like Summon Spirits.
 * I'd drop Dissonance for Summon Spirits. Selket Shadowdancer 13:03, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Well, I made the edits. Mathias Cali 19:41, 2 August 2009 (UTC)Mathias Cali

E/Mo or Emo way vale
This vale team conssists of a E/Mo and an A/Me. The A/Me basically clears up to the reaper and the ele solos the spirits then they come together for escort

[build prof=Elementalist/Monk Fire Magic=10+1+3 Protection Prayers=8 Energy Storage=12][Flare][Ether Renewal][Flame Burst][Inferno][Flame Djinn's Haste][Aura of Restoration][Fire Attunement][Protective Bond][/build]

Inferno can be replaced with a resurrect spell if desired

[build prof=Assassin/Mesmer Attribute1=12+1+3 Attribute2=10+1 Attribute3=8][Deadly Paradox][Shadow Form][Spirit of Failure][Channeling][Ether Nightmare][Cry of Pain][Radiation Field][Deaths Charge][/build]

CoP can be replaced with LoD

Flamingbarney 17:40, 21 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I like these bars but no way in hell I could make anyone run flare. o.o --Carnivorous Cupcake 14:06, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Elemental Lord > Aura too. :) --CarnivorousCupcakeCarnCupcake Muffin.jpg 12:45, 24 July 2009 (UTC)
 * think flare can be replaced by either immolate or lava arrows. same energy cost and activation time. the only differance is 3 sec(immolate) and 2 sec(lava arrows) recharge, which will be reduced by the conset. 88.89.66.15 21:12, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
 * also, id like to know the attribute spread in the ele build.88.89.66.15 21:18, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Replace Flare with Phoenix. The attributes (I'm assuming) are: Protection Prayers:12, Fire Magic: 12+1+3, Energy Storage:3+1. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  21:27, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
 * think prot can be as low as 8, and put the spare points in energy storage. prot bond at 8 and 12 gives the same energy loss. ether with 8 in energy gives 3 energy per enchant, and with 4 enchants up, u get 12 energy + much health per spell. also, i tihnk phoenix have too long recharge and/or cast time to be usefull. i may be completly wrong tho... 152.93.149.33 08:50, 31 August 2009 (UTC)
 * dont think this consept works so good, or if it works, it is a bit slow. u need the vale supp in the start to clear CTC. with this vale them, the sins have to do that themself, which slows down the whole process. it could maybe work if the whole, or part of the whole UWSC team gets new builds to help killing in the beginning. 88.89.66.15 19:32, September 4, 2009 (UTC)

Easier Mountains Sin?
[build prof=A/E name="Mts Perma" sha=12+1+3  cri=3 fire=12][Deadly Paradox][Shadow Form][Glyph of Lesser Energy][Mark of Rodgort][Fire Storm][Snow Storm]["I Am Unstoppable!"][Feigned Neutrality][/build]

Been doing mnts after a loooonnnnggg time away from GW, there's gotta be an easier way to do it. Now, the good people of PvX, tell me if I'm just being an ideeit or if this could work. I would try it myself but I don't have the resources for a mock UWSC run atm.

As for working the build, get up the same way obviously and use GoLE → Mark of Rodgort → Fire Storm → Snow Storm to make Behemoths go boom (wand to in circuit to prevent Healing Spring if one round doesn't kill). Thanks, feedback? :D - <font color="#620460">We <font color="#620460">Heart <font color="#620460">Katamari 09:35, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Hmm, i know that some people use Snow Storm in the standard sliver build for mnts and it looks effective. You kinda need sliver to kill the Slayer in a decent time though, so your build wouldn't work.  Ironboot  × 12:46, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Replace Snow Storm with Sliver Armor? Which you can also use while killing Behemoths, it will just slow it down. - <font color="#620460">We <font color="#620460">Heart <font color="#620460">Katamari 13:27, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

That's what I'd use if I wanted to bring Snow Storm. I think that sliver should be the primary damage source; MoR + Fire Storm is probably less effective than a buffed Sliver. ;/  Ironboot  × 14:08, 22 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Yeah, you're probably right. Thanks for humoring me ^.^ Btw, you think that the Snow Storm variant is better than bringing "BUH!"? - <font color="#620460">We <font color="#620460">Heart <font color="#620460">Katamari 04:11, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

A/E Vale
I wanna ask if it's some kind of sick joke or something. :p I never seen anyone run one. After trying one myself I realised that its extremely slow and to be quite honest A/D isnt much harder to run. Is there something I misunderstand about this build or is it just not viable anymore? :o --Carnivorous Cupcake 22:27, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah its shit, take it out. Andy 22:42, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * A/D vale and GDW nec gogo--TahiriVeila 22:57, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yup, A/D it is imo. --Carnivorous CupcakeCarnCupcake Muffin.jpg 23:42, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

Pits
Link to a video that actually uses the posted build, such as this one Its a bit fast, but its a great tutorial --71.59.135.73 00:15, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Pits Links
Link to a video that actually uses the posted build, such as this one Its a bit fast, but its a great tutorial --71.59.135.73 00:16, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
 * How did you manage a double post on a wiki o.O Drahgal Meir 02:17, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

EotN Ranks
My question is are they essential for completing most of the parts (all except the A/D Pits have such skills)? I mean, if they're reeeally low (like R1-3), is it a problem? Of course that for ultra fast clears under 15 mins it's somewhat important to have them high, but I'm talking for steady, semi-noob/pug times. Btw, UWSCs are great if made how it's right, but this strictly assassin concept is killing me sometimes... Nowadays you can't farm a lot if you don't have a freakin perma :S -- ¡DeAl€Y!  13:06, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
 * qq moar. Technique is more important than ranks to get good times, though they do help quite a bit. <font color="Red">A <font color="Black">ndy 13:41, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Technique is more important for having good times, for great times you need at least r8 Ebon, preferably max--TahiriVeila 14:52, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
 * This is not true, I have 2 Vanguard,2 Delver and 5 Asuran and my best time at wastes is 6min quest (consistent >8min). Best time at pools is 11 min, with that i mean ready for 4h at plains, best time at chamber is 8min (consitent >10min runs), best time at plains is 7min (consistent >9min). That should be enough proof to show it takes more skill than titles:P I do agree, if you want to be like among the fastest, you need higher ranks.--FluffyFTW

A/N Chamber Sin
[build prof=A/N Shad=12+1+3 Curse=12 Deadl=3][Deadly Pa@4][Shadow Fo@17][Price of Fail@13][Mark of Pain@13][Enfeebling Blood@13][Poisoned Heart@13][Signet of Corruption][Death's Cha@17][/build] Basically same usage, except the killing process: [build prof=N/A Shad=12 Curse=12+1+3 Soul=3][Deadly Pa@3][Shadow Fo@15][Price of Fail@19][Mark of Pain@19][Enfeebling Blood@19][Poisoned Heart@19][Signet of Corruption][Death's Cha@15][/build] Just an idea that popped into my head. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  17:12, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * When killing Dryders/Keepers of Souls, Price of Failure/MoP on the same foe, then autoattack with a zealous scythe to prevent scatter. Also, wall trick ftw.
 * When killing the mix of Bladed Aatxes and Grasping Darkness after terrors are down, Poisoned Heart, then MoP + PoF on an Aatxe, then autoattack with your spear.
 * Need nargiez? Enfeebling Blood + SoC ftw.
 * Can also be played by N/A (use golden eggs and candy corn):
 * Looks like it could work, though there is probably a better trigger for SoC than Enfeebling Blood. Tried it yet? <font color="Red">A <font color="Black">ndy 19:32, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * You've already got Poisoned Heart - Enfeebling is just redundant and useless. Not sure what would make sense to take, though. Maybe Critical Agility with some crit strikes? ··· [[File:Dannycbf.PNG]] 19:40, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * If the MoP target dies long after the others, then some normal damage could help - "FH!" or necrosis. If it doesn't, then LoD or Rad field for extra damage/degen? <font color="Red">A <font color="Black">ndy 19:56, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Rad Field is a big energy sink. LoD or Necrosis would be my choices. ··· [[File:Dannycbf.PNG]] 19:58, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * True. I'm not sure SoC will provide enough energy while killing only 4 enemies for UWG. <font color="Red">A <font color="Black">ndy 20:02, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Ups, Zealous scythe. <font color="Red">A <font color="Black">ndy 20:05, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Use Enfeebling for energy management when doing CTC. "Fear Me!" ftl? And I don't think you would need LoD/Necrosis to be quite honest.  If you plan on using Poisioned Heart against Terrorwebs, then degen should kill them. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή  <font color="#007766">[rage]  22:38, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Okay I just burned through 3 consets to test this. MoP has to be taken off the build, because even with the wall trick, it causes MASSIVE scatter. The bar that works is: [build prof=N/A Shad=12 Curse=12+1+3 Deadl=3][Deadly Pa@3][Shadow Fo@15][Price of Fail@19][Enfeebling Blood@19][Poisoned Heart@19][Radiation Field][Signet of Corruption][Death's Cha@15][/build] Use Health degen to kill everything up until UWG. At UWG, use Price of Failure and health degen to take care of the first group of Dryders and the first Keeper of Souls. For all other groups, Cast Price of Failure on the Keeper of Souls, then wait until they autoattack themselves to death. Move on. I did this solo, without any help on CTC, and on my first try I finished in 14 minutes. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  00:08, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I just filmed it with gamecam, I'll post a video here later. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  17:00, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm sure it works fine, but how does it compare in terms of speed and ease of use to A/Me?--TahiriVeila 17:04, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
 * probably easier to use because you don't need to remember to keep Spirit of Failure on something for energy and you can just /afk after PoF and PH are up. ··· [[File:Dannycbf.PNG]] 17:25, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's faster than most A/Me i've played with. Most A/Me finish in around 16/17 minutes.  On my first try with this build, I got a 14 minute run.  Also, suck it, bitches (run in the video is a bit slow, but vale needed help, and I kept getting stuck at the Keeper of Souls near entrance to mountains). + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή  <font color="#007766">[rage]  17:39, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
 * My fastest time with the standard A/Me listed here is 11 minutes, I have a variant that is not listed here and can probably speed it up so that, If the Vale team is fast I can probably do it in 9-10 minutes. Qaletaqa 04:42, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I clear in 12-14 minutes. Would be less if vale teams were faster but oh wellz. This variant is surely the fastest chamber necro there is however it needs self cons to operate and is rather slow; 14 minutes and you werent even killing Dryders. --Carnivorous CupcakeCarnCupcake Muffin.jpg 19:30, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
 * 14 minutes on my own, meaning so help from SS support at beginning with CTC. Anyways, I'm working on a better build that can contend with scatter problems and still has MoP. I can't test it now though, because I am out of town and the nearest internet connection is...the dreaded dial-up. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή  <font color="#007766">[rage]  19:58, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Take that Carnivorous. Can be done in 8 minutes or less, but I cba to find a PuG to do CTC faster. I'm happy with 9 minutes solo. I'll go make a video soon. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  22:35, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * does this work as a/n instead of n/a? or do you have to use candy+corn to raise curses high enough?88.89.66.15 12:10, September 8, 2009 (UTC)

Ritualists
What's the most commonly known builds Ritualists use in FoWSC? And how do they manage energy? Selket Shadowdancer 20:51, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Completely wrong page. Take a look at the Manlyspike.--TheShortOneKlhksjdnfsig.jpg <font color="Blue">$ɧor₮  <font face="comic sans MS" color="teal">talk  21:02, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry I typed wrong question. I meant Rits in Vale. Selket Shadowdancer 21:07, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh okay lol.--TheShortOneKlhksjdnfsig.jpg <font color="Blue">$ɧor₮  <font face="comic sans MS" color="teal">talk  21:10, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Mountains perma
Added a variant to mountains, please discuss.konserv 09:12, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Not sure if we really want pugs who think theyre pro running that. Life Guardian 09:13, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I've seen people run Finish Him! as mnts which is quite effective. Kracatoan 09:24, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Finish Him is quite good, but it eats energy, as to this being hard i did type, for experienced players. The main reason i posted it was because people were having trouble with patterns, with that build it's perfectly fine to miss a few springs as the damage will be very high anywaykonserv 10:29, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Tbh, I don't really understand why people have trouble with the mnts behemoth pattern, it really isn't that difficult to see which behemoth is going to use healing Spring and when, then again, I'm a maths person with a fast internet so it is easy for me. Kracatoan 10:37, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

Technobabble
I ran this in vale on my sin, and I was able to interrupt illusionary was quite nice actually, I wonder if a necro using this could hit them all at once, I know it's a 8 second recharge with cons, and a 5 sec duration at most, I'm still testing it, but I think it could be useful and even save the necro's energy without having to use chillblains, if done right of course, I dunno, just an idea. DBreezy 07:47, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

+10 Armor Shields
Is it really necessary to say that most people need +10 armor against lightning/piercing. it makes it sound like you must use them to participate when they arn't that helpful. Maybe it could have (optional) next to it Kracatoan 17:34, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Lightning shield isn't a NECESSITY but it's very useful for dealing with charged. If you're doing pools i might say it's necessary but everywhere else it's just useful. Fire shield is great for wastes. Piercing shield is bad though, only place you would theoretically need it is mts but if you're on a martial set they'll use whirling so you need a staff--TahiriVeila 19:31, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Having the fire shield for wastes eliminates the need for and healing. --Sam6555 19:38, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * You don't need healing even without a fire shield.--75.95.205.187 19:50, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Made a spelling mistake in first post >.> and suposed to be any. Anyway, been a while since I didn't use any armor/fire armor. I don't really remember. :P --Sam6555 22:45, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

vale typo?
didnt find a good place to add this, so i made a new section for it ;)

in the vale equipment section, it says +20 ench daggers, while the build uses schyte attack skills. any good reason why? 213.167.96.195 20:31, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It should be scythe i assume, tempting as it is to change to schyte - one of the more funny misspelt words in GWs. <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  20:37, 16 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Reading the top of the page, maybe it's redundant because it says up there that they ALL should be carrying zealous scythes. Dream Traveler Haru 00:46, September 14, 2009 (UTC)

Rt/N Vale support
Added a variant that I have used with success for a Ritualist in Vale. Feel free to tweak it up where neccessary if it can be improved. Selket Shadowdancer 01:22, 26 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Maybe Energetic Was Lee Sa instead of Vorizun? Mathias Cali 04:25, 26 August 2009 (UTC)Mathias Cali
 * That could possibly work. I'll try it the next run we do and see how I get on. If I find it to be better I'll add it. Selket Shadowdancer 08:41, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I find Mighty was Vorizun seriously random. I use Energetic was Lee Sa when doing Vale support on my Rit for better energy management. --Carnivorous CupcakeCarnCupcake Muffin.jpg 10:04, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * EwLS sucks, you get a net gain of like 2 energy every 20s--TahiriVeila 12:36, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Which is better than completely wasting your energy on MwV.-- Ikimono "My beard is thick." [[Image:Monk-Paragon-icon.png|24px]] 12:44, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't see what the argument is. MWV works. I know it works because I used it last night and managed to clear Vale easily. You have maintainable +30 energy, along with +15 al without having to resort to high energy sets thus keeping your +4 energy regeneration. You can quite easily make the slot optional and add either as a suggestion or just add EWL into a variant section. Selket Shadowdancer 20:28, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Death's Charge>Shadow of Haste
Nuff said 71.94.8.128 10:13, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * a little more info wouldn hurt imo. yes, u can use DC in wastes, and catch the other group with a longbow, but shadow of haste is much safer for that purpose 88.89.66.15 17:40, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * You don't need a bow. Anyways, a heal is safer than a wasted skill. Mason717 20:15, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * Selfheal + escape from stuck + ability to cover any other areas. You don't need a longbow and it's WAY better than shadow of haste--TahiriVeila 20:22, September 6, 2009 (UTC)

Pits
I wanna start this but I'm wondering about the pits. Would a 20% ench sword and shield v lightnign be fine for running there and a scythe for the damage dealing? Do I need a staff? Also, if someone could post a minimap of the pits route I'd be very grateful. Thanks.-- <font color="Blue">$ɧor₮  <font face="comic sans MS" color="teal">talk  11:33, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * any kind of axe/sword/spear w/ 20% enchant and a lightning shield would be ideal for running to pits, and if using the a/d build a scythe would be your weapon of choice. staff can be used for running, or if while in pits you get low on energy before casting sf, which shouldnt happen with a zealous scythe and crit strikes. on the main page there's a map of all the routes which i believe includes pits Sir Nothing 15:49, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * just noticed, there's also a video tutorial on the main page for pits, you should check that out Sir Nothing 15:51, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

You don't NEED a +10 Armor vs. Lightning shield, but it helps against damage. I personally don't even own one and can get through mountains fine, but I guess it's a matter of choice. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  16:05, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * If you have a decent team and look at the mini-map, chargeds shouldn't even touch you so a +10 shield is useless. I ust have zealous enchanting daggers and a scythe, along with a high energy staff with me whenever I go UWSC regardless of my role. oh and I take a high health, low energy shield enchnating set. Kracatoan 16:08, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

UWsc Vale Support builds
Hope I help people with this threat that are looking for good UWsc Vale Support builds.

UWsc Vale Necromancer/Ritualist Standard build.

[build prof=Necromancer/Ritualist Curses=12+1+3 Soul=8 Channeling=10]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Spiteful Spirit][Spirit Rift][Ancestor's Rage][Signet Of Lost Souls][Great Dwarf Weapon][Chilblains][Flesh Of My Flesh][/build]

Optionals
 * Splinter Weapon over Great Dwarf Weapon, according to the willings of the vale sin.
 * Awaken The Blood over "By Ural's Hammer!", +2 curses attribute. Your own choice.
 * Signet Of Lost Souls for Defile Enchantments.

UWsc Vale Necromancer/Ranger Build.

[build prof=Necromancer/Ranger Curses=12+1+3 Soul=10 Wilderness=8][Dwarven Stability][Serpent's Quickness][Spiteful Spirit]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Defile Enchantments][Chilblains][Great Dwarf Weapon][Sunspear Rebirth Signet][/build]

Optionals
 * Signet Of Lost Souls over Defile Enchantments.
 * Make to your own likings.

Notes
 * More for the experienced Vale Teams.

UWsc Vale Necromancer/Paragon Build.

[build prof=Necromancer/Paragon Curses=12+1+3 Soul=8 Command=10]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Spiteful Spirit][Chilblains][Signet Of Lost Souls][Great Dwarf Weapon]["Find Their Weakness!"]["Fall Back"]["We Shall Return!"][/build]

Optional
 * Signet Of Lost Souls over Defile Enchantments.
 * Make to your own likings.

Notes
 * This build works best with the Uway Chamber - Vale sin - Vale support -- Teams.

UWsc Vale Necromancer/Mesmer Build.

[build prof=Necromancer/Mesmer Curses=12+1+3 Soul=12 Inspiration=3][Spiteful Spirit][Arcane Echo][Desecrate Enchantments][Defile Enchantments][Great Dwarf Weapon][Cry Of Pain][Energy Tap]["By Ural's Hammer!"][/build]

Optional
 * Defile Enchantments for Signet Of Lost Souls.
 * Change Mesmer skills to own likings.

Notes
 * More for the experienced Vale Teams.

UWsc Vale Necromancer/Monk Build.

[build prof=Necromancer/Monk Curses=12+1+3 Soul=8 Smiting=10]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Spiteful Spirit][Chilblains][Defile Enchantments][Great Dwarf Weapon][Castigation Signet][Strength Of Honor][Rebirth][/build]

Optional
 * Strength Of Honor for Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support.
 * Make to your own likings.

UWsc Vale Monk/Necromancer Build.

[build prof=Monk/Necromancer Curses=12 Smiting=12+1+3]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Spiteful Spirit][Desecrate Enchantments][Chilblains][Great Dwarf Weapon][Castigation Signet][Strength Of Honor][Rebirth][/build]

Optionals
 * Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support for Strength Of Honor
 * whatever fits best for you over Castigation Signet

UWsc Vale Elementalist/Monk Build.

[build prof=Elementalist/Monk Fire= 12+1+3 Energy=12+3 prot=3][Searing Flames][Glowing Gaze][Liquid Flame][Mark Of Rodgort][Glyph Of Lesser Energy]["By Ural's Hammer!"][Fire Attunement][Rebirth][/build]

Notes
 * Not many people believes this build, i have tested this and came to conclusion that it works faster then normal N/Rt vale support.

Hope you all have good comments on this thread! Rate + comment! Feel free to add more Vale support builds!
 * missing the template code for the n/r build. id also like to know how u will be able to get FomF on that bar, when the prof is n/r xD Tagachi 15:37, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Added the template code, and added note that it's more for Experienced UWsc vale teams.
 * This works very well on vale nec too, I don't know how to insert those templates though:P

Curses 12+1+3 Soul Reaping 8 Beast Mastery 10` 1. Serpent's Quickness (good as it is with 0 Wilderness Survival)

2. Spitefull Spirit

3. "By Ural's Hammer!"

4. Chillblains

5. Edge of Extinction (extremely underrated, few people know that everytyhing in UW is considered 1 specie)

6. Great Dwarf Weapon

7. Signet of Lost Souls

8. Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support

Alternative: 8. Sunspear Rebirth Signet FluffyFTW
 * still dont understand how u are able to use ritualist skills as necro/ranger xDTagachi 15:54, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * You don't use those any Rit spells in my build:P --FluffyFTW
 * i rest my case [[File:I_rest_my_case.jpg]]Tagachi 21:40, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * Didnt see that flesh of my flesh was in it. Added Sunspear Rebirth Signet instead. Thx for the comment.
 * The main reason for going N/R is that you can bring Edge of Extinction. It's so much better then it seems, remember, EoE considers all foes in UW the same species --FluffyFTW

Vale Nec variant
Add "You move like a dwarf!" ? Nec is the only build that isn't invincible AND the only build that can't be ressed if dead by conventional means. YMLAD saved my life countless times when that stupid Aatxe AI decides to go haywire or valesin delivers a nonperfect pull. Instead of BUH preferably, since shit dies fast anyways.

"most thankless jobs" ?
My vote goes to hardly ever get ectos other than from the chest.
 * 1. Mountains
 * 2. ValeNec
 * 3. ValeSin
 * are you trying to say that we should thank them for doing their job? Sir Nothing 16:05, September 12, 2009 (UTC)
 * Mnts may not be dropping so good, but once in a while you have drops. But although i think it's one of the best areas in the game to play. I like it the most of all areas.
 * Nah I was thinking along the lines of "thankless by drops".
 * I'd say Vale team would be on 1 and 2 and mntns at 3rd place. As a good vale team you only have 4 Aatxes and 3 Terrorwebs that drop ecto. As mntn, you have 4 keepers and 3 terrorwebs. Same amount of foes but as Vale team you have to split in 2FluffyFTW
 * Mnts is harder, and still has almost no drops. Vale also kills more enemies, meaning more random stuff. --[[Image:Jaigoda_endrant.jpg|/rant]]  Jai  writes a  lot . . . 14:14, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * Although, most people learn mnts last and so easily now how to cover pretty much any role. Seeing as PuG UWSCs are flooded with nubs who fail all the time, I usualyl get the chance to cover somewhere and get some ectos seeing as I can usually finish before plains and pools. Kracatoan 15:39, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * True, but the question here clearly was who gets best drops^ ^ --FluffyFTW

Code = [b]OQhiEwAMJU5N54gAuCUUJ6cxA[/b]

(it is preferable to sin to be A/N for enchantment removal) remember to have SoI on at ALL times and put 12+1+3 on illusion magics

Describe the build.