Build talk:Team - 4 Man Ruins of Morah

I would just like to say that after attempting to complete this mission in HM many times before..I tried this build and it was so easy! ty to whoever posted this.. cause now i can finally get my title WOOT Aganork 04:23, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

Why use a four man when you can do it basically solo. why would you wanna farm varesh anyway? There's not a whole lot of demand for runs through her mish--Golden Star 02:01, 6 July 2008 (EDT)

SS is overkill, and SR is kinda useless. Put IP on the SV and use only 1 hero. Probably works just as well. Oh, and Morgahn would only attract aggro with his spear attacks. --84.24.206.123 02:46, 6 July 2008 (EDT)
 * I dont see how SS is overkill. If this is a farm then surely SS just makes it more efficient...--Daedelus 11:23, 18 July 2008 (EDT)


 * The whole point of using 2 necro heroes is it is much faster using both SS and SV. Sure, using only one works just fine, but using both works even better. And you only loose one slot. If you only use SV then Prophet Varesh will go down much slower because she doesn't cast a lot of things on you, and doesn't attack you as much - she is busy casting vortexes. SS works much better on her during this stage. SV works much better on her in her second stage - so I use both. And as for Morgahn - you MUST have him in your group to do the mission, so he may as well do something productive. He does NOT pull aggro away from you by using his spear. I have done this run many, many times with this build and that simply has never happened. As long as you stay between her and your heroes, they will not pull aggro. As for why do this is the first place - I have run people through this mission many, many times. There is enough of a demand for it that I have been asked to post the build. Therefore I am posting the build. Wingfoot 03:31, 6 July 2008 (EDT)
 * You should make a video and post it on youtube :D [[Image:Muffin.jpg|19px]]P WNAGEMUFFIN   crabs  21:54, 17 July 2008 (EDT)
 * I would, but unfortunately I do not as yet have that capability. One of these days I will get that squared away. Feel free to look for me in game as Wingfoot Envinyatar and I will take you through so you can see first hand.Wingfoot 19:19, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

Does pain inverter even work in this? Since the 55 is taking only 5 damage per hit that varesh makes with pain inverter that is only like 15 damage to Varesh (with MAX Asura rank)? Surely you could replace it with something better.--Daedelus 11:20, 18 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Pain Inverter is only in there to speed up the first Varesh... It doesn't work well with the second. I had hex removal in before but never used it. The way I figure I get more use out of Pain Inverter than anything else I would need. It isn't necessary though, as I thought I put in the build page. Wingfoot
 * It would seem more efficient to bring something like snowstorm which would be effective on both of Varesh's forms? I am not sure though since it might aggro the passing mobs. I dont have a monk to trial it with but maybe you could experiment on other PvE only skills? Also I would suggest one of the necromancers bringing empathy and some other anti-mele domination spells. I always found that works pretty well.
 * If you had read teh article thoroughly you would have seen that empathy is mentioned as a possible addition to the necros - you would have also read why I did not choose to include it when I run the mission. Also, Snowstorm would be very risky due to the mob aggroing you alluded to. There isn't a need for anything else in the 55 build - you could run it without any skill at all in that slot. I explain all of this in the article. Please read it completely. Wingfoot 19:17, 20 July 2008 (EDT)
 * For completeness, I'm adding this despite this being an old post - Pain Inverter is calculated on damage before reductions like Protective Spirit, unlike something like Reversal of Fortune, which is calculated afterward. On the Ele variant I reduce damage 100% and still see 100+ damage packets to her. --Falseprophet 16:23, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

I didn't quite use this exact team build, but I used a variant of it. First, I didn't have a monk and second I don't have all the paragon skills or two necro heroes. I used a 130hp Dervish build, a necro, mesmer, and paragon hero. The necro and mesmer had the builds you offer, but the paragon just had standard skills (never played a paragon). Still worked great though, at least on the second time and I did achieve Masters. Holding aggro with commander varesh was a pain though, so i just kept aggro with a bow and let my heroes do the work. Thanks for the team build. Mr.claus 16:02, 21 September 2008 (EDT)


 * SV and 55 monk works just fine-- Shadow [[Image:Relyk Sig.gif]] 16:01, 26 October 2008 (EDT)


 * I also used a variant. I left the heroes exactly like it states, but I ran as a 105 Ranger.  I used [I am Unstoppable] and [Feel no Pain] instead of the Dervish skills and it worked perfectly.  In HM my time was 2:55.  Thanks for the build and for having me use a 105 Ranger for the first time, it was kind of weird. Aldawg227 12:55, 18 November 2008 (EST)


 * I just used this with blessed aura instead of essence bond and signet of infection instead of ear bite. Signet of infection remains useful on commander varesh where earbite wouldnt. Also I went Mo/W since I was having trouble with keeping up I am unstoppable and added balanced stance as a back up. My times were # minutes ish but I didnt rush it like I could have. -- WhiteChaco 3:34, 14 August 2011 (CDT)

variants
I used to run these

forgot to sign--Afya 23:57, 7 January 2009 (EST)
 * Messed around with Lightbringer Signet when working on a 330 Elementalist variant. LBS is only really useful for Prophet Varesh because Commander Varesh tends to stand outside of "in the area" range.  I still haven't settled on a preferred 330 build - currently Glyph of Renewal and Ether Renewal are my two favorites so far (but I still tend to overpull too often - tank-pulling was never my strong suit). --Falseprophet 19:16, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Tiny problem: You can't enter the mission without Morgahn. Oops. Titani Ertan 11:16, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hero 3 tbh. C:\PvX>Abort, Retry, Panic?[[Image:Panic_Sig_Cursor.gif]] 11:19, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

I run it very similarly. On my 55, I put EBSoW in place of Blessed Aura. Kept the SV hero, dropped the SS for a spirit spammer (12+1+3 chan, 8+1 commun, 10+1 spawn, 2 insp), and modified Morgahn a bit (11+1+1 spear, 11+1 lead, 8+1 command, 3 insp):

-- WhiteAsIce 05:03, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I saw an SoS version do hm in 1:51. I'm pretty sure its faster. Any objections to changing it in the build article?--War_Pig5 08:11, June 7, 2010 (UTC)

Blessed Aura
Why? All it does is make prot spirit last 9 seconds longer. If its removed, you get another skill slot, lots of att points, and 1 pip of energy regen. If you reinvest the points in prot and earth, you get more duration on all enchantments and ultimately helps with energy management. So, energy management and open skill slot vs. 3 ore energy from blessed signet (which doesnt make up for the difference in energy management). ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 11:35, 10 June 2009 (UTC)
 * You guys really need to fully look at everything before you posts things like this. There are 12 att points in prot, 12 in earth, 3 (which are the 3 remaining) in divine favor. There is no other useful skill to take in it's spot, an additional 20% longer for prot spirit can help with timing, and I already have full att points in prot and earth. Not sure how you got most of that. And I have never once had energy problems - if you do, you are doing something wrong. Wingfoot 00:07, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
 * There used to be 10+3 divine favor, 11+3+1 prot, and 10 earth. And the fact is, blessed aura still doesnt help with energy.  Now all its doing is taking up space on the bar.  Its completely unneeded.  I dont know what to put there (maybe lightbringer signet) and Ive never run this build, but Im just saying its not doing you any good. --- [[Image:Monk-icon-Ressmonkey.JPG|15px]] Ressmonkey  (talk) 01:36, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree that of the skills on the bar it is the least useful - however I do not agree that it is simply taking up space. An additional 20% longer for prot spirit helps with timing, and the skill does not cause energy to be a problem - so in my mind it is worth taking. If you choose to put something else in for it instead, the build wouldn't suffer, but it does a little more than simply take up space.Wingfoot 07:47, 17 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I put EBSoW in its place to help with spamming PI. Now that I think about it, Leader's Comfort, Mending Refrain, and Signet of Return are useless on Morgahn's bar, but that's a different subject. --[[Image:Jimp.jpg|19px]] WhiteAsIce 04:51, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Viable with 330hp VwK
Has anyone tested this with a 330hp Rit? And is the run even possible with a rit? EgE 07:06, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I haven't tried it, but it should be possible with either a 330 or 110 Rt (a 110 Ranger is even mentioned above) and the heroes provided; the main problem you'll have is lack of Knockdown protection in the base build (Vengeful Spirit Bonder) and your best option IMO is swapping Retribution for I Am Unstoppable! Earth Vortex lasts 20 seconds and you need to tank through it, so you probably want a Norn rank of at least 6 (19 seconds).  When Varesh uses Earth Vortex use the shout and you should be fine. --Falseprophet 22:30, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

For reference, if you want to create additional variants, the tank needs the following. Heroes and even the entire build can vary - before discovering this build I ran a 55 monk with Spell Breaker, pulled Varesh then used a Me/N hero with SV/AV to keep her at 0 energy and adrenaline. The only problem was I would sometimes fail because heroes failed to maintain SV/AV and micromanaging was painful. To be honest, I probably stuffed too many skills on their bars. (also --Falseprophet 22:30, 11 June 2009 (UTC))
 * Tanking skills (e.g. damage reduction + healing or damage negation)
 * Either Knockdown protection or Energy Denial (e.g. Ancestor's Visage/Sympathetic Visage)
 * E-management that can maintain skills above for about 2-3 minutes.

Radiant and Attunement on Morgahn
Why? Read Leadership's description. He's not using much energy on that bar. Hell, he even has Glowing Signet. Slot an adrenaline shout if he really needs energy. Centurion or Survivor, and drop the Attunes for Vitae. MisterB 21:50, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Normal Mode
Even works nicely with masters without the tank in normal mode, saved me 2k many a time :) --Chieftain Alex "talk"  19:54, March 13, 2010 (UTC)

Archive
Well, as Alex said you can solo it with 7HPS. But that does not change fact that this is running build to run people through mission. I think it should stay here. Triss 10:52, 18 July 2012 (UTC)
 * 8 years later: No modern or antiquated hero team build that is still in use should have any trouble doing this mission. I favour an archival. --Krschkr (talk) 13:13, 3 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Assuming all your alts have heroes decked out with good gear and builds, and everyone is aware of the meta. This comp works and is still the best and most consistent one for doing the mission, especially if you need to free up spots for others - be it an alt account, friends, a paid run, or guildmates. I see absolutely no reason for archiving the only comp for this mission. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 14:03, 23 May 2020 (UTC)

Requesting vote wipe and meta tag
I mean, Alex isn't completely wrong, sure. But that doesn't change the fact that during ZMs there's a demand for runners and you can make quite a profit by running it even just for tips (or for alts with multiboxing). Every release since factions had a boss mission that people made running builds for - 2 of the 3 are already tagged as meta, so I don't see why the 3rd (this one) should be archived. Take Imperial Sanctum in factions for example, that one can be done with bonus on HM with henchies, doesn't change the fact that just a week or two ago people had to que for runners because they got so busy at prime.

Never underestimate people's lazyness (and don't overestimate the quality of their heroes). --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 15:36, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * To be honest I haven't seen such a runner the last few times I was paying this ZM a visit, so I doubt that it's actually meta. --Krschkr (talk) 15:58, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I have about 5 alts at this mission and always manage to find runners for them :P Many of them have halfassed hero gear so I wouldn't want to gamble on HM with those. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 16:31, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * It's ZM next week so let's check how frequent runners are and what builds they use. --Krschkr (talk) 20:55, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * I've been standing in the outpost for a while now and despite it's ZM and there are plenty of people there hasn't been a single runner, just a dozen pugs and hero teams. I don't see any reason for a meta tag. --Krschkr (talk) 23:00, 25 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Today's ZM is Ruins of Morah. I've been watching the american district for 30 minutes. PUGs: 9 (=five to seven players). Hero teams: 32 (=one to two players). Runners: 0. --Krschkr (talk) 17:41, 15 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I know you really want to get rid of this build for some reason, but just because you don't see anyone run it doesn't mean that it doesn't work. Sure, let's forget about the meta tag, but it's still worth storing for people that want to run guildmates or their alt accounts through this. If you started advertising a run some people would probably join too. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 13:18, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Not get rid of it. However, since I was waiting for someone to log in while this was the zaishen mission, I found it was a good opprtunity to get some new data on it two years later to verify whether or not it has meta status. --Krschkr (talk) 13:55, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Hexes / conditions duration

 * Usually, conditions and hexes expire 50% faster on bosses. if you turn morghan into a condition spammer and take fragility it would do nice damages and keep nrg management affordable. Jilonor (talk) 18:38, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

General Morgahn's Skills
The skills I put for General Morgahn are pretty much just a random build I had laying around. If you have anything better or any suggestions, please just let me know. I was thinking to maybe go with a P/N and have him take Blood Ritual instead of attacking and adding to the barbs damage. But I decided to go with this instead. MozoGW (talk) 16:18, 25 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Very similar to ? (archived May 2020) -- Chieftain Alex (talk) 17:08, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Oh. Sorry, didn't know it existed already.  I agree that it is not meta but I think that is because not many people knew about it.  I think it is still viable as a run though.  MozoGW (talk) 00:34, 26 October 2020 (UTC)


 * I'm amenable to moving it back out of the archive. Anyone else want to chime in? -- Chieftain Alex (talk) 14:30, 26 October 2020 (UTC)


 * +1, I don't see why the best and only comp for this mission (that even used to be meta) should be archived when it's as good as ever. --DefinitelyNotHanz (talk) 10:00, 31 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Ok I've unarchived Build:Team - 4 Man Ruins of Morah.
 * I think the tank build on the 4 man page is probably superior (can be used on virtually any profession)
 * Not sure about energy management on the 3 man page SS necro but perhaps we can add Barbs to the 4 man page.
 * We should add Empathy to the 4 man page SV necro.
 * Paragon builds are always going to be bad but Anthem of Flame + Barbed Spear should be staples, happy to use the 3 man paragon instead of the 4 man page.
 * -- Chieftain Alex (talk) 11:07, 31 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Will the margonite clerics use skills on Varesh? If so, drop all condition skills so they won't use dismiss condition on her. Spear of redemption, spear of lightning and holy spear would be alternatives. --Krschkr (talk) 13:17, 1 November 2020 (UTC)