Archive talk:P/Me Incoming Runner

looks pretty decent. &rarr; J.J.  berks   (contrib)  13:53, 1 January 2009 (EST)
 * Shall I move it to testing? Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 16:01, 1 January 2009 (EST)
 * Sure. &rarr; J.J.  berks   (contrib)  17:55, 1 January 2009 (EST)
 * Never seen anything like it so in one word: awsome. Anyway, when comparing with other running builds I'd say that it lacks some healing. Never Surrender may help...a lot, but I'd almost say put leader's comfort in there. It probably works well enough - just saying I'm not yet convinced on that point :P - think I'll test it soon tho Shai Meliamne 20:13, 2 January 2009 (EST)
 * You basically have 7 regen lol. That's why I didn't put the Never skills in the main bar, when I run I can never fulfill their conditions. Healing is fine tbh. A two second cast heal for like 60~ would do more damage than help. :S Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 21:19, 2 January 2009 (EST)

Wasnt there something like: [build prof=p/ lead=12+1+1 command=12+1][hasty refrain][help me][we shall return][fall back][/build] -- Christmas Relyk  22:19, 2 January 2009 (EST)
 * I think I've seen that somewhere before. Shinomori 23:01, 2 January 2009 (EST)


 * this runner makes me feel sexy and racist at the same time ƃuoן sı [[Image:Escape.jpg|19px]] ʇɐɔƃuoן 01:26, 3 January 2009 (EST)


 * i made a build like this before the change to "incoming!". It was basically the same, and worked really well... heres a video of it http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0ixnhl81NI8&feature=channel_page

I made a build that was similar to this, but with a dervish primary. the thing is, there are better running builds for dervishes, and paragons are pretty much crying out for one. I like this build simply because someone's made a running build for paragons. Now that person on the main discussion page will be satisfied. It looks like it has good survivabilty, perma-IAU (the basis for my dervish build) is amazing for runners. Constantly gaining health while you're running (another idea I used for my dervish) works really well too. I wish I had space for a paragon now... HareeMuh 09:58, 3 January 2009 (EST)

I'm not keen on how the Leadership attribute works but this build seems kind of energy intensive unless you're removing hexes with Inspired and Revealed Hex. I hope to be proved wrong, though. A paragon runner would be a nice addition to the wiki. Shinomori 13:26, 3 January 2009 (EST)
 * Well, the paragon skills alone burn your energy, and leadership gives back 1 energy for each shout, but this is where ether signet shines. Your hex removal skills also can give back energy off of hex removal. And if you get the dwarves spawn in snake dance... Need I say more? >:D Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 14:11, 3 January 2009 (EST)
 * I agree that Ether Signet is a great asset to this build but the recharge....Shinomori 23:30, 3 January 2009 (EST)

its 25 energy every 40 sec, the paragon will regen 26 energy in that time-- Christmas Relyk  23:44, 3 January 2009 (EST)

Yesh
I think it should look like this. Leadership is enough at atb lvl 4, so that it's just enough for 2 casts of FB/Incoming. If, as mentioned above, the paragons energy will be enough for constantly maintaining a speed boost then Ether Signet is not necessary.. and Ether Signet is pretty much just a waste of 1 sec + aftercast. That leaves us able to max a whole new attribute if we want to. And Hex Breaker is friggin' strong here. You can activate it long before you enter a mob and so it has recharged before you even enter it, allowing you to skip the first 2 hexes cast on you and you still have 2 removals left. There are no mobs that could snare through that. [build prof=Paragon/Mesmer Command=12+1+1 Leadership=3+1 Motivation=7+1 Domination=4 Inspiration=9][Enduring Harmony]["Incoming!"]["Fall Back!"]["I am unstoppable!"][Mending Refrain][Inspired Hex][Revealed Hex][Hex Breaker][/build] Mending Refrain lasts constantly if activated right after the first cast of Incoming/FB, this giving regen even when standing still. --''' -Ch ao  s-   07:34, 4 January 2009 (EST)
 * TBH I'll take the longer enduring so I have a greater window to cast IaU. And ether signet really does help in snake dance. It's an emergency thing lol. And you don't need the heal from mending. Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 12:17, 4 January 2009 (EST)

"Probably the safest Droks runner out there, fast and its a paragon!! woot!! -Jjberks" My W/A is the safest :P This just says ohai to rubberband ^^. Lol I'm stupid to mention this anywhere at all.--''' -Ch ao  s-   16:21, 4 January 2009 (EST)
 * If you want to get technical, the safest is a W/Rt, but that's pretty slow. =P And yes I have done it. Getting stuck means nothing. You just farm the mob until you escape. xD And I will get to testing your build, Chaos, but the loss of charging strike hurts. >.< btw if you ever need help with a run build, just ask. I have everything but a rit and a necro. :) Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 19:18, 7 January 2009 (EST)
 * Oi, I'll remember. W/A is faster atleast, and Death's Charge out of a mob means something. --''' -Ch ao  s-  [[Image:TheDentist.jpg|19px]] 04:30, 8 January 2009 (EST)
 * Dolyak Signet + vwk on war? On a rit, try sprint, vwk, balanced stance/iau and some self-heals. A vwk rit ran me from rankor-dreadnoughts and soloed Maw for me when I wanted to cap it. But she was pro.
 * Necros could run until they changed AotL. Now you just use the /A one. --''' -Ch  ao  s-  [[Image:TheDentist.jpg|19px]] 04:30, 8 January 2009 (EST)
 * Noob, just use N/Mo. And you don't need dolyak signet on a w/rt. Invincible  Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 17:16, 11 January 2009 (EST)
 * My point is not getting safely there but actually being fast. Dolyak Signet and vwk is for farming... and the runner was Rt/W back in the days of Factions/NF :D -- -Ch ao  s-  [[Image:TheDentist.jpg|19px]] 08:40, 12 January 2009 (EST)

:D yay
finally, a Paragon runner. Looks versatile McStrong. I want to see a video of this in action.  <font color="#0000CC">Ŀ¥ЅЅΔΝ <font color="#0066FF">● <font color="#0099FF">55!  19:44, 5 January 2009 (EST)


 * meh, the only thing innovative about this is that Hex Breaker cancels nothing :D --''' -Ch ao  s-  [[Image:TheDentist.jpg|19px]] 19:49, 5 January 2009 (EST)
 * I love incoming for running, but im sure there must be better uses for some of these inspiration skills..I heal if you shut it 05:45, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

lool
stop archiving it, idiot. -- -Ch ao  s-   12:20, 9 January 2009 (EST)
 * ^--72.189.85.14 03:56, 10 January 2009 (EST)

wow alot of synergy in this bar. Never seen something so perfect for a profession that has very few options.--JRyan 18:14, 7 February 2009 (EST)
 * Agreed, this is impressively creative & synergistic. - [[Image:Ins420sig.png]] 420 14:43, 8 February 2009 (EST)


 * i want to pleasure the OP [[Image:Lann-Revive Animal.jpg|19px]] Long  Cat  21:02, 18 February 2009 (EST)

Meta - Is this really one of the most used running builds :/ <font color="Blue">Frosty <font color="Blue"> po!  20:49, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
 * not really, Tai just tagged what he deemed the best choice for each profession to run with. I can fix. -- -Ch  ao  s-   20:53, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Meta is about the best, no matter what profession that impies to both pve and pvp [[Image:Frostrage.jpg|19px]]<font color="Blue">Frosty <font color="Blue"> po!  20:55, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

Minipets
I remember reading somewhere that they count as allies for leadership. Nothing absolutely amazing, but if this is the case then running with a mini out will provide a tiny bit extra energy.--118.90.27.74 22:00, 11 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Nevermind, apparently this is not the case.--118.90.27.74 22:23, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Me Likes
hex breaker running. I was wondering if it was worth making a new page for this: [build prof=Dervish/Mesmer Mysticism=12+1+1 EarthPrayers=10+1 Domination=7 Inspiration=4][Avatar of Balthazar][Eternal Aura][Fleeting Stability]["I am unstoppable!"][Vital Boon][Inspired Hex][Revealed Hex][Hex Breaker][/build] just tested it and it works great Elegent 00:18, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
 * That would work, we just have better builds available for dervishes. <font color="#AA0088">Invincible  <font color="#AA0088">Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 04:21, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
 * No steps no a derv runner make me sad. <font color="Black">Drah <font color="DarkRed">Mc <font color="Black">Ninja  04:34, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
 * The lack of steps does suck, but its definately easyer and safer than the ones here on wiki, btw its elegent, cba to sign in 81.97.93.229 10:22, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

Me/P
Will it work? I understand that Mesmers aren't made for running but with 0 leadership, you can still keep up enduring albeit barely. It would be less effective for sure but would still work be better than the Any/A and Any/D caster build yea?AMFan 12:05, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd probably rather use Me/D, wouldn't comment before looking at builds. Illusion of Haste gogo -- -Ch  ao  s-   12:16, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

P/Mo
i just went absolutely crazy yesterday finding out my para isnt useless anymore when i saw this build on the nets... must say i used something similar for running some chest runs in south shiverpeaks with hasty reaffrain, but still i didnt think incoming will be boosted so imbaly..... anyways heres my variation... changed attribute due to the fact that pah got changed from energy regen to gay. [build prof=Paragon/Monk Command=12+1+1 Leadership=3+1 Motivation=7+1 Smiting=9][Balthazar's Spirit][Smite Condition][Smite Hex][Castigation Signet]["Fall Back!"]["Never Give Up!"][Enduring Harmony]["Incoming!"][/build] [build prof=Paragon/Monk Command=12+1+1 Leadership=3+1 Motivation=7+1 Smiting=9][Balthazar's Spirit][Smite Condition][Smite Hex][Castigation Signet]["Fall Back!"][Hasty Refrain]["Never Surrender!"][Defender's Zeal][/build] Also in the second variation some slight attribute adjustments must be made into the favor of smiting prayers.... True thing is if you dont need the 2 extra energy from castigation signet,then why bother? Cheers! -muscolo Altho not needed, you can swap smite condition for i am unstopable.... -muscolo


 * I cba flaming you. But those suck. -- -Ch  ao  s-   17:31, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * because smiting is so cool. [[Image:Zyke-Sig.png]] 05:48, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Because you can, doesn't mean you should. Mesmer secondary is better in every way. PVX-RustyTheMesmer 11:35, April 11, 2010 (UTC)

Update based on latest skill changes
Should we remove Enduring Harmony and look for a good replacment skill for that slot/leave it optional and list some since the new Incoming and Fall Back buff's should make Enduring Harmony un-needed? (although still atractive just for I am unstopable duration bonus)59.167.217.223 17:01, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * You'll still want it for "I Am Unstoppable!". Also, longer duration chants means you have to use them less often, using less energy in the long run.  17:24, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd keep enduring harmony. Paragons aren't the best in the way of energy. =( Also, 24+ second IAU is just too awesome to pass up. <font color="#AA0088">Invincible  <font color="#AA0088">Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 19:16, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

Proposed Variant
Hello everyone. I posted this as an independent build and it was recommended because it uses "Incoming!" and "Fall Back!" that it should be a variant of this build. The build is as follows:

[build prof=Paragon/Any Command=11+1 Motivation=7+1 Attribute3=8][incoming][fall back][help me][feel no pain][optional][i am unstoppable][bladeturn refrain][mending refrain][/build]

The philosophy of this build is a little different than the Incoming Runner build, in the sense that the latter is more hex oriented, where as this build has much more healing. The advantages include being uninterruptible since it relies on zero casting time shouts, high rate of health regen on the move, and a heal that can be cast on the run. The optional skill and large remaining skill points lets you include another useful skill. When I initially proposed this build, I suggested going P/A and using Heart of Shadow as a panic button. Not only does this refresh the screen if you're lagging, it also gets you out of a potentially dangerous situation with a shadow step.

What do you guys think of this as a variant?Super manboy 17:45, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's an okay alternative but not nearly as good as the posted one, as this one doesn't have any hex removal and can be easily snared. + <font color="#004466">ℓγ <font color="#005566">ss <font color="#006666">άή <font color="#007766">[rage]  18:07, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Death's Charge rules, why in the world would I use HoS? -- -Ch  ao  s-   18:30, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, you "can" use it after you've passed monsters to pop out of their bubble.--72.189.84.187 19:08, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Spam it on recharge unless your life is actually threatened by staying too long in one aggro. -- -Ch  ao  s-   19:10, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I use HoS because I occasionally lag when running, and I loath lagging while running. It was only a personal preference, but something I found useful.  I find with this build you can take a pile of heat and not have to worry.Super manboy 20:50, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

awesome! new builds these days favor rit's and para's, my 2 favorite classes. i can do droks on my rit, but i tried this out on my para and it works like seeing those un-real baseball movies where the baseball"flies" through the air straight and smoothly. thats what this build is. straight, smooth, and pwnage. faster than perma sin. the onlt thing faster than this is that NuB A/D sin build on youtube of a lvl 9 running droks. whoever created this, i <3 u,(thats just a form of speech, i dont literaly mean it).68.227.202.180 01:08, October 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * Seeing as how a permasin is the slowest runner there is, I agree with you. -- -Chaos- (talk) -- 09:27, October 7, 2009 (UTC)

I think you guys should take a look at the above build again, and compare the numbers. Firstly, this build was never designed to run through areas where there are hex based snares. It was designed to run the rest of the 90% of the game. The build was designed however to be fast and heal for a lot on the run. That is, no stopping.

The sustainable healing for the build is 25 hp/s (or 12.5 pips of hp regen). This is in addition to 17% dodge and an emergency 193hp healing. I have however, improved the build. Please consider the following:

[build prof=Paragon/Assassin Command=11+1+1 Motivation=8 Leadership=4 Shadow=11][incoming][fall back][i am unstoppable][help me][heart of shadow][shroud of distress][bladeturn refrain][mending refrain][/build]

This build on the other hand is has a sustained healing of the following: 33 hp/second (16.5 pips of health regen), 80% dodge and 193 hp of emergency healing when below 50% health. I have been toying with this and have found this to be extremely effective. When combined with two para heroes and a warrior with "Incoming!" "Fall Back!" and "Never Surrender!" for instance, you can have both para running skills on you at once and healing at the same time (26 hp/s or 13 pips of health regen) alone. If you still have doubts, go outside the Tihark Orchard and run circles around the large mobs of Heket out there, then try the same with anti-hex Incoming Runner build or any other running builds to see how long you last. Nothing compares to its healing.Super manboy 02:15, November 27, 2009 (UTC)
 * The build on the main page was designed solely for droks, so your point is kind of moot. Also, you shouldn't need that much healing with 96AL (with a shield). Fall back and incoming are plenty. <font color="#AA0088">Invincible  <font color="#AA0088">Rogue [[Image:Invincible_rogue_siggy.jpg]] 02:32, November 27, 2009 (UTC)
 * lol, that explains the lac of interest in it. I didn't see Droks mentioned anywhere on the initial build, but now that you mention it that is obvious.  I was directed to post this as a variant to the original build after posting my build as an independantly developed build.  Their argument was that the philosophy of the builds were the same since they used the same running skills.  You are right, the high AL combined with the healing allows for a lot of damage to be soaked.  This build can be run very easily, even by people with little experience.  It is meant to strong arm its way through things with brute healing.  I am the type that likes to share the love, and everyone in game that I have shared this with has been a fan.  I was hoping to contribute and share it with more people, however this hasn't made it to any list yet which is a shame for people who want to try new things or need something like this.  The fact alone that this is such a useful general purpose primary paragon running build says something in itself.Super manboy 02:54, November 27, 2009 (UTC)

Archive once again
Lalala so once again this is slow compared to P/A.Demonic Sin Ex 01:36, 25 November 2010 (UTC)