Archive talk:E/Mo SoR Flag Runner

Wouldn't you want to go for the regen breakpoint at 12 Prot? --NYC Elite 12:04, 24 June 2007 (EDT)

Probably :P. Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 12:47, 24 June 2007 (EDT)

As much as I hate this build, the list of usable runners with the warding and blurred nerfs consists of this build, Monk runners, and Rit runners... Which is sad. I miss offensive runners(although I'm not quite sure that the old Icy Shackles E/Rt can be accurately called such with not even enough damage to outdamage the healing provided by healsig on a mesmer with no armor who's using frenzy and 0 tactics). We need and SoR Mo/E runner build, now. --Edru viransu 16:50, 24 June 2007 (EDT)

Offensive runner O.o? There were few to begin with... Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 16:53, 24 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Air spikers a long time ago. - [[Image:Kowal.jpg|15px]] Krowman   16:55, 24 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Yeah...Air Spike was pretty imba though. Took Anet only a few months to realize that lmao. Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 16:56, 24 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Cripshots and other ranger runners were fairly offensive. Shatterstone water eles were pretty offensive. Mind Blast, Bsurge E/Rts. Me/A runners back when Shadow of Haste was good. Besides, one of the main reasons at least some top guilds started running an LoD monk at stand was that it allowed them to use a more offensive runner. --Edru viransu 17:04, 24 June 2007 (EDT)

Isn't this just the metta E/Mo Flagger???
 * Yes, that's the point. The poster never said he invented the build. VegaObscura 08:29, 1 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Meta is Meta for a reason. It's good.  What's wrong with that.  [[Image:DE Sig Test 2.jpg|50x19px]]  *Defiant Elements*   +talk  08:34, 1 July 2007 (CEST)

The attributes are wrong. Everyone runs 14 Water, 10 Prot. Water runners are slow enough already without knocking two more seconds off Armor of Mist, and SoR is plenty homosexual enough without taking 12 in Prot. 87.74.70.98 19:16, 2 July 2007 (CEST)
 * I find this usage of homosexual to be offensive. Can it please be moderated. Zuranthium 19:52, 18 August 2007 (CEST)
 * I don't think policy actually prohibits such use of homosexual unless it's directed insultingly at another person. --Edru viransu //QQ about me 20:46, 18 August 2007 (CEST)

2 seconds does not make the difference when running. 20% of Enchanting Mod. Mending Touch and SoR break points need 12. Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 22:52, 2 July 2007 (CEST)

Of course you take a 20% enchanting mod - but that's irrelevant to what water spec you use. Seriously, the SoR and MT breakpoints are a lot less important than the AoM, FG, IS and BV breakpoints. I'll say it again: everyone I've ever spoken to in mid to very high level guilds runs 14 Water, 10 Prot. 12 Prot kinda works too, but it isn't the meta flagger. My guess is that the people pushing for 12 Prot don't actually GvG with this build - or at least not at a reasonable level. 87.74.52.141 14:27, 3 July 2007 (CEST)

Agree, should be changed to 14-10-8 imo. Tycn 14:59, 3 July 2007 (CEST) /agree, I run 14 10 9 actually. Napalm Flame  ^_^ <font color=#0000ff>(talk)·(contributions) 22:40, 11 July 2007 (CEST)

Speak less, do more. <font color="Black">Readem (<font color="Red">talk *<font color="Black">pvxcontribs ) 22:44, 11 July 2007 (CEST)

GASP!!
GASP!!! READEM PWNS FACES!!! HE CAN USE 12 10 9 ATTRIBUTES!!! ZOMG!!! :D I'll fix it for ya :D&mdash; Cheese Slaya  ( Talk ) 03:01, 3 July 2007 (CEST)

u scare me cheese... <font color="Black">Readem (<font color="Red">talk *<font color="Black">pvxcontribs ) 00:51, 27 July 2007 (CEST)

Aegis
With the nerf of Aegis, what do we replace it with. Can't log on to check the meta. Bob fregman 07:13, 12 August 2007 (CEST)
 * Guardian, imo. --<font color="Black">Edru viransu //<font color="Red">QQ about me 07:18, 12 August 2007 (CEST)
 * /agree, the recent buff to guardian makes it a good option indeed.Bob fregman 07:54, 12 August 2007 (CEST)


 * Everyone runs Guardian. Why no replace plx? —ǥrɩɳsɧ  ƿoɲ  13:02, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * Most people I've obsed run reverse or veil. --<font color="Black">Edru viransu //<font color="Red">QQ about me /sysop 14:09, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * I would drop Spikes for Guardian, but that may be just me. Tycn 14:13, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * The power of Spikes as an AoE snare should not be underestimated. --<font color="Black">Edru viransu //<font color="Red">QQ about me /sysop 14:21, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * I don't know, WASD is pretty powerful too... Tycn 14:27, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * I don't know, retreating so your team doesn't wipe or pushing so you can win the game might be slightly more important than making sure to not get near a teammate. --<font color="Black">Edru viransu //<font color="Red">QQ about me /sysop 14:29, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * It's a very useful skill at times, true. Guardian is slightly more versatile though. Tycn 14:35, 25 September 2007 (CEST)
 * Blurred + SoR = enough to keep someone alive. Reverse/Veil makes you actually have a chance against a war, ranger + water ele split. - [[Image:Weapon_of_Fury.jpg|20px]]<font color="Black">Unexist  18:17, 30 September 2007 (CEST)

High Level Versions
I consider there to be 3 good versions of this bar:


 * Ice Spikes, Reverse Hex (FGust Blurred SoR Mendtouch GLE AoMist)
 * Ice Spikes, Extinguish (FGust Blurred SoR Mendtouch GLE AoMist)
 * Vapor Blade, Ice Prison (FGust Blurred SoR Mendtouch GLE AoMist)

You could run Vapor Blade + Reverse Hex/Extinguish as well, though I haven't seen it.

All versions are run at 12+1+1 Water 8+1 ES 10 Prot. If you're not going to go to 14 Water you should just run a Monk or Rit. I fixed the main article to reflect reality. -Ensign 02:17, 4 October 2007 (CEST)

Ok. Ty for doing that. <font color="Black">Readem (<font color="Red">talk *<font color="Black">pvxcontribs ) 02:38, 4 October 2007 (CEST)

Mending Touch vs Dismiss Condition
Mending Touch removes 2 conditions at once, but has double the recharge of Dismiss Condition, making it just barely remove conditions faster, but as long as you have Gaurdian, SoR, or Armor of Mist on you, Dismiss can be used as a self heal even without conditions. Even if you had 2 conditions on you at all times, Mending Touch would just barely heal for more, and that situation as pretty rare in a fight against anything besides a ranger. The only situation where I can possibly see Mending Touch being better is against a Cripshot Ranger. Anyone agree? VegaObscura 14:58, 5 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Mending Touch saves you against SP without having to spam SoR on yourself. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 01:44, 6 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Sins, cripslash warriors, rangers. In all of those situations, MTouch > Dismiss. The list of meaningful conditions on a split generally consists of those from the things I just mentioned and deep wound. --<font color="Black">Edru viransu //<font color="Red">QQ about me /sysop 01:53, 6 October 2007 (CEST)
 * Good point. VegaObscura 06:05, 6 October 2007 (CEST)

Other Than GvG??
( With the allies using self heals a bit ) Very Plausable although I switched out Ice Spikes for Rez Sig. Armor is used defensively mainly as a kite / armor boost, but the rest of the build is used the same sort of.

Would like to know if anyone else had used it in other arena's and had a good result.


 * I wouldn't seriously consider running this character anywhere other than GvG, and in any capacity other than as a primary flagger. It's a very specialized, relatively low power character designed to fill specific needs in that role, and is poorly suited for anything else. -Ensign 04:48, 20 October 2007 (CEST)


 * That's the problem with some of (if not all) the best builds - they're very highly specialized and can't really be used in other places. That said, I've always been told that if I want to try out a new build I'm not familiar with, I should give it a run or two in RA. However, this build doesn't have most of the features required to excel in RA. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 05:44, 20 October 2007 (CEST)


 * I would say it work's very well in RA as a healer... All you have to do is really "Change" the way you use a few skills and after that it's all good Experienced 09:17, 24 October 2007 (CEST)

Used Anymore?
Do guilds still use this as their runner? Smooths 21:42, 2 December 2007 (CET)
 * Some used it in the Monthly. Works well with Assassin ganks, last I checked. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 05:20, 3 December 2007 (CET)

Seen
This popping up again in a few gvg's, wonder if it could see a return. / Fros  T  alk  \ 21:59, 11 June 2008 (EDT)

Unarchive?
Only just realised this was archived. Sure, it's not as good as it once was, but it's still a solid flagger bar, and a good alternative to the WoH bar for an ele flagger if you have partyheals elsewhere in the build. Make the bar this to compensate for skill changes:

--<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  18:30, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * You're a BM, so you have the wisdom of dealing with this stuff. Go for it, or I'll do some serial copy-pasting. --Guild of Deals<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 18:35, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I'm not sure whether it should be. It still works in certain cases, but I dunno whether there's enough times that it would be useful over WoH for it to be worth it. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  18:44, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Still, it has its plus sides. It has a good Armor boost, more Prot Prayers (Guardian and such), and it can outperform WoH in some situations. It may not be Great anymore, but I'd give it a Good atleast. --Guild of Deals<font color="Black"> * Wah <font color="DAA520">Wah  Wah! * 18:50, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * ups / Fros  T  alk  \ 18:59, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * It is usually ran with Holy Veil when I see it, just to help / Fros  T  alk  \ 19:09, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
 * With the SoR nerf, taking Veil makes it inferior to WoH in every way. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  05:58, 15 June 2008 (EDT)