Archive talk:Mo/any WoH Flagger

uhhhh shouldnt u add the usage before u sumbit it for testing??--24.190.23.113 21:07, 7 December 2007 (CET)


 * No, because if the person reading this isn't a bumbling half-wit then they'd be able to figure out how to use this. That said, feel free to add the usage to this. —ǥrɩɳsɧ  ƿoɲ  21:15, 7 December 2007 (CET)


 * Summed up the usage in two short sentences. [[image:User_Godliest_Icon_ritualist.jpg|19px]] GΩdlﺄεﻯt -_-  22:03, 7 December 2007 (CET)


 * Needz more guardian. - [[Image:Unexist sig.jpg|20px]]Unexist  11:21, 8 December 2007 (CET)


 * There are like, 60 quadrillion variations though. I mean, you can edit it to whichever variant suits you but this is the one I've seen quite a bit. —ǥrɩɳsɧ  ƿoɲ  13:36, 8 December 2007 (CET)


 * That's not a answer. Needz guardian, w/o prots you're dead. Drop PS or something for it.- [[Image:Unexist sig.jpg|20px]]Unexist  17:54, 11 December 2007 (CET)


 * PS is hawt for Burning (Flame Sentinals). —ǥrɩɳsɧ  ƿoɲ  03:55, 12 December 2007 (CET)


 * The times you go gank, you either do this, 1: kill sentinels at start, this way your woh stand monk ps's. 2: wait untill sentinels are raped(8 mins i suppose, idk exactly anymore). 3: let your ranger solo them, with flat/longbow he can stay out of their range. No need for ps. - [[Image:Unexist sig.jpg|20px]]Unexist  09:53, 12 January 2008 (EST)

Love the usage descriptions XD 69.40.247.197 21:04, 8 December 2007 (CET)


 * What!? Who changed usage? The previous one was clearly superior! [[image:User_Godliest_Icon_ritualist.jpg|19px]] GΩdlﺄεﻯt -_-  06:06, 26 December 2007 (EST)

Needs flam jinns haest so u can hav powerfull fire dmg and bern stuffz. Misfate 23:39, 1 January 2008 (EST)
 * brning speed imo i rly like it i pretend im the human torch wehn i use it FLAME ON!!!!hehe --71.229@home 23:41, 1 January 2008 (EST)

What about going ZB to lower your attribute spread? We run this in our current setup as WoH but I would think ZB might be nicer on a split.(75.134.131.172 00:31, 7 July 2008 (EDT))

Update...
Updated the entire page, in the future put just a little more effort into the build article before submitting >_<! --Hikari 04:09, 21 January 2008 (EST)
 * Jokes r hawt. - [[Image:Unexist sig.jpg|20px]]Unexist  08:55, 27 January 2008 (EST)

Bad character
See my vote comment and discuss. :) Zuranthium 14:51, 29 July 2008 (EDT)

well i do agree in your statement, but i the 2sec recharge, 80hp heal is pretty nice, couple it whit GoLE and you get a 10energy 160hp and you can spam as energy allows. WoH tbh is just great for everything, altough i do agree the SoR is the best Runner all in all (altough lack on split) the WoH is also great when you must support party etc.. Idk how many times my Heal Party 40/40 spam has saved my team x) - I've played the Rit, WoH, SoR, HB all x) - in around around r400 and the Rit is just so plain meh.. Half the bar is nerfed to oblivion and just bad overall on surviveability etc, altough nice whit CC when using Smiter for extra dmg :D.. But Rt suckz in split and does just mediocre now in Stand whit nerfed AR and Splinter. SoR is nice for running flag etc but when splitting and having Djinns loosing energy when moving and having the Hardcore heal at Regen and 15energy is kinda :( also SoR is pretty nerfed(from what it was) and in the long run when splitting SoR is :( They just swap target :/ and 2sec heal is :(:(.. HB runners just dies to easy just boring obsing the HB vs Warrior they just die like flies(lack of prot) But the WoH! ;D Good Prot (can chain Guardian)..WoH is great for Splitting and Deffing(i can prot the base alone vs Warrior, Ranger and Runnner by position well and use Guardian well :)) So tbh WoH(defensive)> Rest :/ Massive   18:02, 29 July 2008 (EDT)
 * 1 Glyph Lesser + 4 Heal Parties = 45 energy for 288 healing over 30 seconds. 1 Recup + 2 Kaolai pots = 45 energy for 340 healing over 30 seconds. At stand, Rits provide abilities other than just healing - unremovable prot (Weapon of Warding...this skill is nearly essential to have in your team somewhere; can be so important for keeping up key targets at VoD) and damage (Caretakers Charge=free and Ancestors Rage is still efficient, or you can use Channeled Strike which can be great on split). Dash is also better than Storm Djinn's Haste. I'm not sure what you mean about the HB runner, you take the same amount of prot. Likewise with the SoR guy, you have both Guardian and Patient, those concerns shouldn't be that big. Enchant removal is the biggest problem, but you're less likely to face that in skirmish situations than you are interrupts or KDs.


 * This build really won't solo-defend very well against good splits. Mo/A is so much better if you're looking for the best runner in terms of base-defending. I still see no realistic scenarios where you'd want to slot this character. Zuranthium 03:28, 30 July 2008 (EDT)


 * Well what ive seen it splits is that i use SoR, then swap target and Patient Spirit spam isnt that good..Altough now when Splitting isnt used almost at all and protting the lord is great i say SoR might be better ;)  Massive  [[Image:Image-Massive Sig.jpg|19px]] 10:48, 10 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Yeah, people can target swap, but you should be positioned so that they have to run full cast range to get to you. Can also use Guardian. The new VoD change does indeed make SoR better. Zuranthium 18:53, 11 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Monk runners were hawt when ppl ran bsurge ele's with splinter and anc. People didn't knew back then, that recurp was gud. They thought rit runners were there for splinter + arage. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  17:02, 27 September 2008 (EDT)

Take out of Archived?
With some changes to the build, could this be taken out of the Archives? its not incredible, but it works. And with the nerf to HC wouldn't it be comparable to most of the other running builds in the meta right now?
 * Most likely yes. MT > YAA? PVX-Zyke 22:42, 19 March 2009 (UTC)


 * imo, this should be put back in testing. Adriaanz 12:18, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

meta?
i dont play much anymore, but when i left woh flagger certainly was not meta. Gringo 23:20, November 18, 2009 (UTC)

soldiers speed even with only 15% should replace sprint imo, its alot more maintainable if taking disciplined.. Jax 00:49, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

Running one of these is suicidal 99% of the time in this metagame. I believe that it should no longer merit being in the great category.

Should it be kept, balanced stance/sprint is far superior to dstance/sprint. --Lemming 11:18, April 28, 2010 (UTC)

No point in keeping this build around. When in the past year and a half did anyone even run this instead of a Rit, E/Rt, or HB Monk? I also see that my comment in the vote section from forever ago was removed, with bad reasoning from Frosty. What I said was absolutely correct, as time has proven - other flaggers are better. Frosty's line about Spirit Bond defeating split Fire Ele's is quite hilarious; did everyone forget about Fire Shields at some point in time??? Not to mention that it doesn't prevent Lord damage anyway. Zuranthium 04:29, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * NPCs dont have fire shields, and i would rather not be on a fire shield with spirit bond up, then be on a fire shield without spirit bond. not that all of what youre saying is wrong, just that frosty is right about spirit bond. Gringo 04:35, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Spirit Bond is completely unnecessary for saving NPCs if you were to run this character in the first place. You have Word of Healing. Spending 10 energy on Spirit Bond when it will only trigger on Rodgorts/Meteor is a waste. Saying you would rather be out of shield set and maintaining Spirit Bond on yourself, rather than staying in shield set and not having Spirit Bond on, is very silly too. The reason - it's far less efficient yet again. You'll be taking full damage from Mind Blast and Spirit Bond won't even prevent all the damage from Rodgorts/Meteor. Your energy is FARRRR better off by staying in Shield Set and you'd be less likely to get spiked out that way as well if they are splitting something like a melee + fire ele on you. Zuranthium 04:57, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * 8 hits, you can assume 1 rodgort, 3 immolate, 3 mind blast, 1 meteor. for 10 energy, you go +60hp off the 3 immolates. rodgorts does 30 damage, meteor does 0, and mind blast does 150. so basically you take 120 dmg over 8 hits. normally even in fire shield you'd be taking a couple hundred. ooooooooooops! Gringo 05:04, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * also, putting spirit bond on an npc and then dishing your energy elsewhere is helpful. and no one is stopping you from archiving. Gringo 05:15, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hurray more debates about minutia. You are wrong, however, and I shall explain further. To start with, your Spirit Bond is only healing for 76 because you spec 9 Prot. If you stay out of Shield Set you'll have either 60 or 75 armor, depending on if a condition is on you. If a condition is on you, Immolate will not trigger Spirit Bond. You take 59 damage, I think, from a 15 spec Immolate if your armor is 75. Let's assume that your armor is at 75 half the time. For the benefit of your argument, I'll round favorably and say that 2 of the Immolates do trigger Spirit Bond. You'll take 200 damage from Rogorts and Meteor, 209 from the 3 Immolates, and 170 from the 3 Mind Blasts. That's a total of 579 damage and Spirit Bond triggers 4 times, for a total healing amount of 304.


 * 10 energy for 304 points of healing...Word of Healing will heal for 203 and it costs 5 energy, clearly more efficient. Sitting in your shield set means you wouldn't have taken nearly as much damage in the first place. In your scenario, sitting out of shield set, you have to not only maintain Spirit Bond but also cast WoH to clean up the rest of the damage (a total of 275 points, not counting degen). Sitting in your Shield Set would have provided just as much defense as Spirit Bond (since you're getting +30 armor) at the cost of...nothing! Plus, if there is in fact someone else there with the Fire Ele, staying in shield set makes you FAR less likely to be spiked. Your shield set will prevent damage from that other opponent AND you won't risk you being caught prone when you're KDed right as Spirit Bond ends. Zuranthium 20:07, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * the cons though would be that if you only ever wait to cast when you're under 50%, you're at more of a risk in dying, and if you spirit bond you can cast elsewhere. in the scenario i was talkin it was just like a fire ele had split to your base. if it was anything else with a fire ele i wouldn't dare leave my shield set. slap an archive tag on this btw, i cba. Gringo 20:49, May 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Just use Patient Spirit. Still more efficient and gets around interrupts too if that's what the problem is. Argh, I suppose I will do the archival. Let me look up the tag, I forget how to do that. Zuranthium 01:03, May 20, 2010 (UTC)