Build talk:Mo/W RA Healing Burst

Yet to be updated
Hey there, author of the build here. Just wanted to note that it hasn't been update for the increase in target heals. Should be up to 160 at 15,150 at 14. So I want to hear what you guys have to think but, please keep it on the build.Don't be nabs and ignore the build and just bash me as a noob.Caplan 16:20, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Omg nab, no but seriously this is a decent alternative to woh since the target heal was increased. Frostels 16:38, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Lol, ya. I especially love this in 8v8 runs in FA,HA, and in PVECaplan 16:41, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Just wondering, how do people run party heals in GvG now when they don't run Healing Burst? Lame passive rit flaggers? -- Brandnew. 16:42, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Or even lamer smiting midliners? -- Brandnew. 16:42, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * No, don't you know? Everyone uses mending now!Caplan 17:17, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * It's just rit flaggers, Heal Burst just provides even more party healing. Great vs trip melee and other high pressure builds. Frostels 17:24, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Spirit channeling rit flaggers who basically just sit at stand spamming recup + life + pots + weapons while midliners/warriors run more often than not.--TahiriVeila 18:04, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * cool meta bro. -- Brandnew. 19:27, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

" throw up a Bonetti's before casting WoH to help avoid a Distracting Shot from a Ranger". this is burst, where do u get word of healing?
 * Error that O already corrected.Caplan 23:46, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

"Divine Spirit and Deny Hexes - Instead of Cure Hex and Spotless Mind, to provide a combination of energy management along with a double hex removal skill. " If i use divine and then deny, it will be triple hex removal.
 * People are strong copy paste. -- Brandnew. 19:27, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * No it would actually still be 2 hexes. Deny counts towards itself along with divine spirit being recharged. That's only 2 skills at which to power the removal.Caplan 23:46, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

PLEASE SIGN YOUR POSTS
It's as easy as putting 4 ~. Not that hard people.Caplan 23:46, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * No.

Divine Spirit
Need to add in Divine Spirit somewhere or else this build just won't heal through some spikes. Especially for RA. The addition of Divine Spirit also makes Deny Hexes a viable choice for hex removal. Personally I find this build to be a little low on non-self damage mitigation. Especially for RA, you get a lot of dumb people who don't know how to kite. --Ayanamij 00:04, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Learn to manage energy.--GWPirate 00:24, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Lol you don't use divine and deny in ra with woh. So why would you with burst? Btw its ra,ab, and cm's. Who spikes as a team?Has more heals than even pnh.Caplan 01:33, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I sometimes use Divine and Deny in RA with WoH... Or at least, I used too when I still actively played. ^_^ -- Brandnew. 02:13, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * "Learn to manage energy" doesn't really work in RA when your with crappy teammates who don't kite and just take it in the face from Hammer Warriors. It's not a concerted spike from a team, it would just be a spike in damage. And anyhow Divine with Deny works fine in RA against hex stacks ... Cure Hex or Holy Veil also work well. --71.56.114.3 03:27, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Doesnt really matter much tbh.--GWPirate 11:16, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * IMO it matters because DS is really good for RA. --71.56.114.3 15:43, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * DS is for idiots who can't manage energy (on a direct healing bar). It's only useful on ZB bars.  More redbar/self-defence skills > DS. &mdash;  Scythe   17:20, 12 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * no Frostels 18:32, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * No, DS is good for RA where people don't know how to mitigate damage. This is an RA build. DS is ideal for RA because you'll have people who don't kite or people who Backfire themselves, etc. "Learn to energy manage" doesn't change this fact. It's a lot better than packing a Monk bar with 3 Warrior skills for RA. --71.56.114.3 19:30, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Who doesn't spike as a team in RA? If you got decent team mates and are looking for 25, you always spike. Its not hard to just control+space as a warrior and have eles watch the screen. Baned 20:18, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You realizing you are talking about RA people, right? ;) -- Brandnew. 20:20, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Sure, if you can get them to spike, by all means, do it. Good luck with that. --71.56.114.3 20:39, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Its a lot easier than you think. Even if you are dealing with a 12 year old or some random tard, just say HEY FOLLOW MY TARGET OK??? 7/10 times they actually do. Guild wars is stupid easy Baned 20:44, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You overestimate the skill of people in RA. --71.56.114.3 20:47, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * An awful lot. People in ra generally suck and don't know not to attack the monk for the mes who has 10 health right next to them or to not chase a guy halfway across the map rather than switching to a noob non kiting target.Caplan 23:09, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

because
slapping a different elite on it makes it SUCH a different bar. Also: no self hex removal will get you raped. No cure hex mainbar means less redbar, which will get you raped. &mdash; Scythe   3:03, 12 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * Erm, Cure Hex is mainbar lol Frostels 10:29, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
 * brb buying glasses. &mdash; Scythe   15:31, 12 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * YA it makes a HUGE difference ;)Caplan 23:09, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Sig of Rejuvenation > Virgorous spirit
Patient and Burst just dont heal enough on their own to keep a caster alive, or any target being pressured. 4 sec recharge is too long to use it to catch spikes. And 2nd, you dont need anymore anti pressure other than Burst. Cancelcasting signet is also lolz Ocirne23 16:58, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I perceive Rejuv. Sig is used only because E.Surge mesmers will eat monks alive with e-denial. Vigorous Spirit is better than Rejuv. with outstanding over-time healing, but costs additional energy that they might not have when an E.Surge mesmer is present and camping you. E.Surgers will steal a monk's energy in a heart beat, but Rejuv. costs nothing. Cancelling Rejuv. is also good to make interrupters waste their skills on you [if you're experienced enough at that mind game]. So all in all, that's the logic of Rejuv. Signet in a nutshell. --SiriusBsns 02:22, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Also, it is almost impossible to keep a guy alive that has 3 attackers on him without a 3rd direct heal. 82.73.104.149 17:49, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * If you're losing all your energy from an ESurge mes, you're probaby not hiding your energy. The advantage of Sig Rejuv would be that you can always cast it in your defensive set, and that it's passive energy management. However, that still isn't enough to outweigh Vigorous' pressure-relief capabilities. The only reason I'd see for not running Vigorous here is that Healing Burst already does Vigorous' job. It's a toss-up, IMO, and I'd say it'd be best to list both as an optional. -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  21:02, December 17 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure why some idiot changed it. I had vig spirit main bar. I changed it to an optional. So if you guys could possibly edit your ratings that would be appreciated.Caplan 21:53, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

I tried this build and I think Orison would be a good replacement with Patient Spirit. Its way too prone to enchant removal. Also, heal other is a better heal cause high energy=more heal, plus there are very little hexes and conditions in RA, so they can be put in for some pets.216.218.211.128 23:55, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Troll more subtly next time, nub. -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  00:15, December 18 2010 (UTC)


 * I added SoR because it is impossible to keep your retarded 60 aL casters alive without a direct 3rd heal, using virgorous as energy management is a waste if you dont have enough heals to keep your team alive. O lolol everyone dead but me still haz full energyz. Might aswell run a dervhealer then. 82.73.104.149 12:09, 18 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I think SoR might be more useful because of its versatility. It gives you options when under dangerous hexes and energy denial and when dazed. It's also an alternative but less effective self-heal (only 75hp) if there's no other option atm. But SoR alleviates problems before they occur so it seems really hard to figure out.108.49.88.183 12:08, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Shield Bash instead of Bonetti's
Means you can take 12+1 Divine, though you have 8AL less because of no Tactics (of course, you could always just keep the same attributes just for the extra 8AL). To be honest, I much prefer Shield Bash over Bonetti's, though. I just don't like not being able to cast in my stance, especially without prots on the bar. The problem is that when you need it the most, which is when there's high amounts of pressure and/or you're low on energy, it's probably not ready because you're too busy kiting and casting. And more importantly, you need to keep casting, which you can't do if you're in Bonetti's. Taking Shield Bash also means you aren't vulnerable to Wild Blow/Strike/Throw/Whirling Axe, which is fairly common in RA. Maybe it's just me, but I just never really found a good use for Bonetti's, except for when I'm bored, there's no pressure at all, and there's a warrior training me the whole match. -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  16:41, December 18 2010 (UTC)
 * troll more subtly next time, nub. Frostels 23:47, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm as ignorant as anybody. I'm just looking for some explanation. -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  02:47, December 19 2010 (UTC)
 * i use shield bash, thats probably why no one else should--Christmas sig.jpg talk  10:22, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Bonettis is the e-management option in RA, nuff said. &mdash; Scythe   15:49, 19 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * also only 6AL less.--GWPirate 15:54, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Bonetti's is emanagement, and against all ranged teams (like rangers), you can pop a bonetti's before a WoH/Burst to make sure your shit doesn't get interrupted.  —ǥrɩɳsɧƴ ɖɩđđɭɘş  [[Image:Grinshpon blinky cake.gif|19px]] 16:11, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * 7 AL...strength shields give +9 Falrach 16:34, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * 9AL vs 15 AL. that's 6. Frostels 21:58, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * 7/15 @ 8 give 25AL vs. x even with drawn weakness. &mdash; Scythe   22:05, 19 Dec 2010 (UTC)
 * lolpvx math--Christmas sig.jpg talk  22:19, 19 December 2010 (UTC)
 * indeed. &mdash; Scythe   0:09, 20 Dec 2010 (UTC)

I still don't really get the whole energy management thing you're saying Bonetti's is going to do. The only time you should really need energy management in RA is when there's actually a halfway decent team you're facing. But halfway decent melees will know to switch targets as soon as you put Bonetti's up, especially since everyone runs Bonetti's and thus should know how to counter it. Plus, when you're low on energy it's usually because you're having to cast a lot, and casting ends Bonetti's. Real conundrum there. In other words, in my experience Bonetti's only will give you energy when you don't actually need it. On the other hand, it seems that even pretty good warriors (and Sins even more) are easily countered, or at least mindgamed, by Shield Bash. It's fun when they just autoattack for a while because they don't want to use attack skills in fear of Shield Bash going up.

I mean, this might all just be personal preference, but I'm just wondering what other people are doing differently. -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  16:26, December 21 2010 (UTC)
 * I usually steam-roll through stance-whoring monks with Whirling Axe, but some of them have gotten smart and brought Protector's Defense and Dolyak Signet, which both are irremovable. --SiriusBsns 13:09, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
 * It's funny when people try to use Whirling Axe to counter Shield Bash. ^.^
 * So it's at least valid enough to list as an optional? -- Jai' s Crappy Christmas Sig...  -  17:42, December 23 2010 (UTC)

Jai you're bad. You run shield bash/prot defense & bonetti's. Use shield bash/prot defense to preprot hammer/sin chains. Use bonetti's when you have more than one melee attacking you (free 8s block stance with some minor emanagement is mad win) or when sb/pd is on recharge. Everything else you should be able to kite/powerheal.--TahiriVeila 04:34, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Different play styles, tbh. I rarely attack stuff because I prefer to kite, so it would take like half a match to charge Bonetti's. Also, the "ends when you use a skill" part really annoyed me, especially when it's on a bar without any prots. And yes, I know I'm bad, and I knew that I would probably get flamed for saying something against Bonetti's, but I just figured I would suggest some alternatives. I simply find that I do better without Bonetti's than I do with it, that's all. -- Jai . -  12:10, February 4 2011 (UTC)
 * Playstyle is an excuse for not figuring out what is optimal tbh. 98.118.72.14 13:12, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

not as good as woh in my opinion. vigorous spirit basically accomplishes the same thing but better (at least in 4v4). sor and vig should be mainbar. draw and spotless optional. everything else looks fine. Readem 23:06, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

bonetti's actually does something. Shield bash is useless once melee's figure out how to count in their head 132.177.62.173 01:38, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't go that far. Shield bash is fine as long as you don't use it preemptively. Readem 03:48, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Btw to random person above, no condition removal in ra is marvelous right? Because conditions are totally useless and that is why its totally meta............Caplan 21:58, 11 February 2011 (UTC)
 * you are such garbage lol. stop thinking you are good. Readem 20:47, 12 February 2011 (UTC)
 * readem got whoru'd lol-- Relyk  talk  08:17, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
 * I know lol. Readem 10:43, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
 * When you use bonetti's, by the time the melee stops attacking you they would have hit you once or twice for free energy, 5-10 energy in most situations can save a match. And as mentioned above melee stops hitting you..less pressure. Alcahmahol 05:13, 20 March 2011 (UTC)

Shadow Arts
I prefer taking Return and Dark Escape @ 8 instead of the warrior stuff. It just seems to work in more situations more often. --Haseo 16:47, 1 March 2011 (UTC)
 * 8 SA might be too much because of how much it cuts into Divine Healing for only 1 second on each sin skill. Tactics is brought to 8 for shields primarily. With no Q8 shield you can drop it to 7 with no skill difference and gain prot for Draw Conditions or 4 tactics to only lose 1 second.
 * I would say either way though that using /A stuff (Return/Dark Escape/Smoke Powder Defence) is a common enough variant to using /W stuff to be listed. Widow maker 13:39, 12 November 2011 (UTC)