User talk:Jaigoda/Sandbox

Invoke in NM>dual mes in NM. Just thought this would be a bit more NM-stylo. ~  Ӎiñon  04:23, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Considering I'll still be balling and stuff, maxing out at 3 targets doesn't sound appealing. For a cspace build, though, you're probably right. -- Jai . -  04:29, November 16 2011 (UTC)
 * I've always looked at it like this; you've got Mark of Pain and Splinter Weapon. You don't need alot more AoE damage, but Invoke (in NM) is a strong multi-target attack and has even more bar compression than Discord. The bar is essentially Invoke, GoLE and Air Attunement. Then you have 11~ attributes to split into command, prot or monk. Also, why not run an Orders bar (see the meleemancer team in my Sandbox for example) so you don't need a second RoJ (probably something better to take in NM than extra support). OoP and Blood Bond do exactly the same as the whole RoJ bar, and it's more consistent. OR you can take MoP or some command skills on the Orders, or RoJ even. ~  Ӎiñon Crysig.jpg 04:35, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I already have plenty of AoE between the RoJ's and the FoC necro, there's really no need to try to add more damage on top of that. Stuff still does damage in NM, so Panic/Inept and all the good mesmer stuff is still useful for shutdown. Adding command or prots or something would be great, except I already have command on 2 chars and prots in the form of ST. Orders... meh, it's never going to add as much damage as RoJ, and Blood Bond might end up with decent healing for you, but all the other heroes will suffer (and outside of the RoJ monks I only have 2 heals, which is a bit of a stretch even in NM if you're not EFGJack). Not to mention that for Orders to be efficient you really have to have multiple melees, which is not going to happen here.
 * And I can't ignore this: Are you really going to say that an 8-second recharge spell that at best would heal for 150-200 is more consistent than a char that has 3sec, 6sec, and 12sec recharge skills that each heal for 84 every cast, along with the fastest-recharging one preventing up to 70 damage, as well as two party-heals that heal for 54 each? And you're also going to say that OoP does "exactly the same" amount of damage as RoJ? I'm really trying to discuss stuff with you in a reasonable manner, but pulling crap out like that makes it extremely difficult to do that. -- Jai . -  04:51, November 16 2011 (UTC)
 * You can bring RoJ on an Orders bar. You have more reliable energy on a necro. But also this; RoJ is 10DPS only due to it's 20s recharge. I was saying OoP was more consistent, and it's easier to hit above that goal hitting a possible 3 foes. You also get Smite Hex and Smite Condition on the Orders bar, so there's no lack in cleaning. It's definitely worth taking for one human melee. ~  Ӎiñon Crysig.jpg 05:21, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I stopped at RoJ on an Orders bar. -- Jai . -  05:30, November 16 2011 (UTC)
 * I doubt it. But if you didn't; do continue. It's a gripping read. ~  Ӎiñon Crysig.jpg 05:46, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Anyway; Blood Bond>all those heals; because you should be the only one taking severe damage, if you're tanking EFGJackway. You seem to have a hard on for him, so I would presume you are. ~  Ӎiñon Crysig.jpg 05:54, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * No. If I was tanking as hardcore as EFGJack (who Relyk is obsessed with, not me), then Orders would be retarded anyway because the whole point is to spike balled mobs, and RoJ is going to do far more damage over the first 5 seconds than OoP. But considering that I'm not half as good as I'd need to be to pull that off, trying to survive with Blood Bond instead of multiple 80+ heals is just stupid. The fact is, in a setup where you're even somewhat balling mobs and spiking them, Orders is going to be inferior to RoJ. OoP will NOT do as much damage as RoJ even in the first 10 seconds, and Blood Bond starts healing AFTER everyone is dead, whereas RoJ heals before, during and after. If you really need the utility from Orders (command, prots, etc.) then Orders MIGHT be worth it, though it still is behind several other heroes. Putting OotV and Blood Bond on a N/Rt healer is one thing, but making a necro with a primary role of Orders is never going to come out with you doing more damage than if you'd added a RoJ, mesmer, or rit (or even an Invoke for that matter). -- Jai . -  11:50, November 16 2011 (UTC)

lolinvoke-- Relyk 09:18, 16 November 2011 (UTC) ST Rit in NM, you're such a pansy Jai. Just take one resto, 6 offensive heroes and nuke the shit out of any mob. I gotta agree with excluded on this one, the only dungeon I see this being useful is Slavers. Vorpal  12:22, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * For pulling, not really anything else. Would bring Prot Spirit on somebody, but fuck enchantments getting removed. There's already an overkill of offense (NM foes don't kite from RoJ IIRC, or at least they get hit with all 5 triggers before they get out), so a small overkill on defense is fine. -- Jai . -  19:45, November 16 2011 (UTC)
 * There's your bar compression right there. Now slot an Invoke over your smiter and drop the ST rit for a minion bomber with prots! At least it would look more NMey :p ~  Ӎiñon Crysig.jpg 15:25, 16 November 2011 (UTC)
 * So lower damage, less healing. SoH deals less damage, and OoP is always used badly by heroes (you'll be lucky to have it up 2/3rds of the time), so barely any per-hit damage added. Loss of RoD/Heaven's Delight/Divine Healing means far less support capability. No added utility besides Jaundiced Gaze. Face it, Orders is just outdated, and hell, it's never been used well by heroes. -- Jai . -  19:45, November 16 2011 (UTC)

Warrior
that is a shit warrior bar, this is better
 * --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 76.118.156.169 (talk) at 13:32, 16 November 2011 (UTC).
 * Sign you bad IP, and this is pve right. Prot strike is more of a pvp skill tbh. -- [[image:Chieftain Alex Sig.jpg|19px|link=User:Chieftain Alex]] Chieftain  Alex  13:42, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

heroway
3 EA and 2 ineptitude with MM is like no spiking power at all-- Relyk 15:17, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * 900 damage in ~2.5 seconds (3x Rodgorts + 3x Fireball/Liquid Flame + EBSoH), just from the ele's, isn't a spike? You could also get about another 200 from the mesmers and 200 from Putrid and IV, and almost all of the damage would be nearby AoE. -- Jai .  -  15:25, January 24 2012 (UTC)
 * There are some rounding errors in that statement-- Relyk 15:29, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * 900 is exact, actually, to 3 sig figs. The mes stuff is between 225 and 250, and the necro stuff would be around 185. Still, that's over 1300 damage under ideal circumstances (i.e. micro). And the time estimate is 2.25 seconds between Rodgort's and Fireball (Liquid Flame would be 1.75s), and everybody else is assumed to be casting only once, so that'll all be under 2 seconds. -- Jai .  -  15:35, January 24 2012 (UTC)
 * Putrid Bile and IV only do damage afterwards. The damage from EAs will be staggered based on armor. Fireball and damage from illusion mesmers are conditional for spiking and don't hit immediately. Makes for a really shitty spike.-- Relyk 15:58, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Ok. -- Jai .  -  19:52, January 24 2012 (UTC)
 * D:-- Relyk 23:01, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

User:Jaigoda/Sandbox
If you take Judge's Insight you lose mark of pain and running melee becomes pointless... Cover enchant is usually SoA or Aegis, albeit usually aren't necessary with all the mesmer shutdown now.  PermaSwag    22:40, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm only concerned with enchant strips while balling, at which point the mesmers would be flagged back and stuff. And yeah, I wasn't really thinking about the JI/MoP thing. Again, most of the crap here is random theorycrafting. -- Jai .  -  14:08, May 26 2012 (UTC)