Build talk:N/any Order of Undeath

Discussion
by far the best MM build ever made, ever. - Skakid9090 19:51, 17 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Best MM build, EVER. I LOVE this build. It is... GODLY. I still prefer Minion Bombers though, FAR more dangerous in HM. Napalm Flame  ^_^ [[Image:Napalm_Flame_Sig_Image.JPG‎]] (talk)·(contributions) 04:48, 18 July 2007 (CEST)

You know, i've been using either Flesh Golem or AotL for forever now. Might be time to try something new.--Reason.decrystallized 03:18, 20 July 2007 (CEST)

All you did is switch out flesh golem for OoU :P--Relyk 23:52, 20 July 2007 (CEST)

too complicated to merge, completely different build usage. - Skakid9090 21:34, 21 July 2007 (CEST)

looks like it will work out great, cool idea &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by Warrior Zez (contribs).

do u intend to sacrifice urself in ab. cuz that is wat ur gonna do. i just wanna tell ya. ur gonna die if there is less than 3 targets.

^^ I agree. This has far too little defense. I would have at least Dark Bond, if not Infuse Condition also. Dark Bond does not even require many points in blood magic to make it effective. --BlueNovember 17:40, 27 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Read the variants section plz, this build was unfavored before because people didn't like dark bond. &mdash; RAWR! [[Image:Skasig.jpg|19px]] Skakid9090 04:17, 29 July 2007 (CEST)

I found that, on my Necromancer, this variant worked much better. I used only Vampiric Horrors to gain more healing and thus cast Order and Blood of the Master faster, and I used Verata's Sacrifice to keep my minions alive until I built up a sizeable number of them. Any comments, or opinions? --Xaositech 14:58, 4 September 2007 (CEST)

This is highly ineffective because 10 vampric horrors with OuU have less dps than 10 bone fiends without OuU (this was tested and can be seen at the talk page of OuU).

Attributes and Skills
[build prof=Necromancer/Monk Death=12+1+3 Blood=10 Soul=8+1][Order of Undeath][Animate Vampiric Horror][Blood of the Master] [Masochism][Blood Renewal][Dark Bond][Verata's Sacrifice][Resurrect][/build]

Bug?
Although this Build clearly has the PvE General Tag, it isnt listed under Great PvE general Builds (I followed the link on the mainpage.) Is this intended and if not, can someone fix it pls?84.136.218.228 00:09, 26 July 2007 (CEST)

People claiming this is a good build can't have done much MMing. -Moloch
 * You must be bad at math. &mdash; RAWR! [[Image:Skasig.jpg|19px]] Skakid9090 04:16, 29 July 2007 (CEST)

No, I just have a hard time understand why a MM build with no self defense, no healing apart from highly unreliable vampiric horrors and an 8 seconds recharge signet, no condition removal and an extremely dangerous elite could be considered for Alliance Battles. The first SP assassin looking at you, you will be dead.

Note, I AM NOT GENERALLY OPPOSED TO RUNNING ORDER OF UNDEATH. This, however, is a very fragile and incomplete build. -Moloch


 * there's healing in the variants. the old OoU build was unfavored cause people didn't like the specific healing used, so i made this one flexible. lrn2read plz &mdash; RAWR! [[Image:Skasig.jpg|19px]] Skakid9090 04:39, 30 July 2007 (CEST)

I know how to read, and I checked the "variants", but if the build posted as the ground build is a suicide build something is very wrong. -Moloch


 * if you're not smart enough to put a healing skill in the optional slot then you deserve to die. &mdash; RAWR! [[Image:Skasig.jpg|19px]] Skakid9090 04:43, 30 July 2007 (CEST)

1 Healing Skill in the optional slot will not cut it, thus yes, you will most definitely die. -Moloch

When I go out tank hunting on my echo mender in PvP, I leik to bring no armor and 5 healing skills. Trust me, I rox. Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 06:11, 30 July 2007 (CEST)

ab tag removed
there. Skakid9090 04:51, 2 August 2007 (CEST)

Um I used this build in AB along with another Necro who had Aotl. We used arcane mimicry on each other and we actually did some pretty good dmg and killed the other team. So honestly this build can work for AB as long as you put in self defense and have another necro so you can have a minion horde with OoU. Which =mass amounts of armor ignoring dmg.
 * There'll be too much competition between you two for corpses, and Arcane Mimicry can only work so well. The player with AotL originally will only be able to use OoU for 20 seconds every 80 seconds (1/4 of the time) and the OoU will only be able to use AotL once (or twice if you bring Arcane Echo, too) every 80 seconds. Bone Horrors also don't synergize as well with OoU as Bone Fiends (and Vampiric Horrors), and by having them, you lose on your potential to have either Bone Fiends or Vampiric Horrors. BotM sacs can also hurt. In AB, Flesh Golems are actually pretty decent, because your opponents' armor's rarely over 100. ــѕт.  мıкε  22:28, March 25, 2010 (UTC)

Unnecessarily complex
All you really need is order, vampiric, blood, and the signet. the rest is optional. one extra minion spell plus rotting flesh/vile miasma works for me, and the build is insanely powerful. I just think the build as it is on the page doesn't really show that half of the skills are optional.--Tentacle Love 07:51, 9 September 2007 (CEST)
 * Vampiric horror has 15 sec recharge. When i use my Order of Undeath build(bit different from this one), i don't even use vamp horror. Bone Fiend is all that's needed, vamp horror is just there for health management(which doesn't even work IMO).--99.225.4.255 19:15, 27 January 2008 (EST)
 * yeah fiends are all i ever use with OoU and i agree all you need is fiend blood and sig. the rest are optional death magic skills or pve skills or res slots. also, i always bring ESoH for fiends for extra damageJoeai 20:15, 27 January 2009 (EST)

Rename
Rename build to N O U Minion Master imo.  —ǥrɩɳsɧƴ ƿıę  17:19, 28 December 2007 (EST)

E/N
Aside from not being able to have 13+ Death Magic, wouldn't an E/N with high Energy Storage be just as good? With just 12 Energy Storage and regular ele armor, the ele would have 76 energy (i believe) Then with a 8 more energy from insignias, and 8 more with 4 runes of attunements, And with a Sup. rune of energy storage and Energy storage head piece, the ele would have... maybe 90-100 energy. which is quite scary 0o -- Tensaryu
 * So why would you want that when you have SR? Why would you want that at all? Swiftslash \\  [[Image:Impale.jpg|19px]] (contributions  * sandbox ) 13:35, 22 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yeah...Soul Reaping > Energy Storage for MMs. And 10 Minions > 8 Minions.  And higher stats on your Death Magic skills > More energy on your bar. -- 69.157.64.199 19:45, 2 March 2008 (EST)

What about a N/E that used Glyph of Restoration + Animate Bone Fiend for a quick heal and Glyph of Lesser Energy to reduce burden of energy? Soul Reaping does wonders for energy, but 25 energy is heavy for repeated use. You'd just have to do OoU + Signet of Lost Souls and after they die, Glyph of Restoration + Animate Bone Fiend. --Eyekwah 06:51, 5 March 2008 (EST)
 * The Necro gets 9 energy when something's more than half dead and another 13 when it actually dies. Especially if you run this on heroes who're pretty on the mark when it comes to SoLS. - zomg!  [[Image:panic_sig.png|19px]]  PANIC!  06:55, 5 March 2008 (EST)
 * Glyph of Lesser Energy is cheap. Requires no points placed in Energy Storage to give you benefit and allows you to have points in attributes other than Soul Reaping.  You lose a skill slot but you gain Blood Magic.  Fair trade, no?  --Eyekwah 08:11, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * The att's are 12/12 at the moment. Throwing in ES doesn't affect Blood. But, seeing as it's N/any, go ahead and suggest it in variants. It won't actually hurt the build in any way I suppose. Just a bit less utility for you. - zomg!  [[Image:panic_sig.png|19px]]  PANIC!  08:19, 6 March 2008 (EST)
 * I only meant that since it doesn't utilize any Soul Reaping skills and some Blood Magic skills would be nice, to compensate the loss of energy gained, Glyph of Lesser Energy would allow you to do so at the loss of a skill slot only. Dark Bond seems rather important, particularly after OoU is used to prevent a easy kill.  Just my two cents.  --Eyekwah 04:48, 10 March 2008 (EDT)

Heros
How does this work for them, I can't check ATM.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * Fine, last I checked. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 23:18, 23 February 2008 (EST)
 * Works pretty great for me, although, I replaced Resurrection Signet, Animate Shambling Horror and the Optional for Dark Bond, Infuse Condition and Draw Conditions. One thing I found necessary, is moving Signet of Lost Souls, Animate Vampiric Horror and Blood of the Master to the left and Animate Bone Fiend to the right. Heroes rarely use Blood of the Master during battle so their minions die off pretty quick sometimes. -Mike 17:32, 26 February 2008 (EST)

I herd Splinter Weapon...
...pwns with Vampiric Horrors, especially with both Vampirics and OoU. It's counted as Vampiric's damage, and is therefor also added to your health. Maybe make it a variant? --Sir Bertrand 15:42, 11 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Won't the Level of the minion reduce the damage from Splinter Weapon (like I heard it does with Ancestor's Rage)? You'd have to manually target minions for it to work, minions attack to slow, and they can only hit one target at a time, so it isn't worth the trouble. It wouldn't be bad to have Splinter Weapon to cast on a Barrager, but if you wanted more damage/health gain from your minions, use Ebon Battle Standard of Honor. My OoU Minion Master Hero takes Foul Feast+Infuse Condition, though, so he wouldn't have the room, but I usually take EBSoH on my PvE Imbagon. -Mike 16:02, 11 May 2008 (EDT)
 * I don't know if it reduces the damage, but they're lvl 18, so it won't make a big difference. Maybe SW itself won't do much real damage, but it increases your health gain, reduces the number of vampiric horrors you need, and increases the fiends/shamblings you can make, ending up in even more damage. And you can always use it on party-members. Maybe heroes can manage this well, can anyone test this? (I can't play GW) --Sir Bertrand 12:05, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

OMG
OoU GOT HIT REALLY FUCKING HARD I MEAN WTF ANET  * Jebus  *   Is    I  Enter my contest! 22:59, 7 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Build:N/any_Order_of_Undeath for BIG SPIKE!!! ــмıкε  нaшк  23:02, 7 August 2008 (EDT)
 * some of the things in this update i like. some of them, i like because i'll abuse, but i wonder what they were smoking.  some of them--like this--there's just no conceivable point to.--Reason.decrystallized 11:08, 8 August 2008 (EDT)
 * OoU was my favourite MM Elite, but I'm trying to find some use for it. >.> ــмıкε  нaшк  11:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)
 * good luck with that :S.--Reason.decrystallized 11:15, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

OoU question
Does the loss off health with OoU count as sacrificing? If so wouldn't Masochism be a good choice in the bar? TedTheFarmer 20:29, 10 January 2009 (EST)
 * Its health lost, not sacrificed health... no synergy for Masochism. -- Falconeye

DO u have to micro OoU on heroes? mine done seem to use it very often ~Flesh Atrophy~ "I R MudKipZ"  00:40, 19 June 2009 (UTC)

Masochism
Would it or would it not be pure rape with this? -- Frosty  <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Mc Admin  14:09, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I'm trying to work out if I can be bothered to sort this build out or whether it should just worked it into Build:N/any Minion Bomber Hero too <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  14:44, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Maso makes me happy. I like running +1+1 Death Magic on my heroes and it still acting like I have a superior rune :D [[File:KJ badge sig.png]] <font face="Arial" color="gray" size="1">14:47, 11 September 2009
 * Guess I'll clean this up, and we can decide to merge later <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  14:49, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Also isn't Death Nova pointless in this build since your trying to keep up an army of minions that aren't just a wall -- <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Frosty  <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Mc Admin  14:50, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * And Vamp Horrors are pretty much required for a OoU build. I think these should probably remain separate or you're going to end up with a ton of optionals/variants. On a side note, isn't Maso + OoU like 5% health sac? Not that you'll be casting the whole time or anything, but that seems like a lot of hurt. [[File:KJ badge sig.png]] <font face="Arial" color="gray" size="1">14:56, 11 September 2009
 * Hmm, I think you miss out on a lot of damage if you don't include Nova. Actually N/D with Mystic Regen looks pretty strong to counter sacrifice. <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  15:08, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * As long as it's tagged for both general and a hero, I'd leave Nova optional even though it does huge damage. Heroes are great with Nova, but as a player, it's a pain in the ass. [[File:KJ badge sig.png]] <font face="Arial" color="gray" size="1">15:14, 11 September 2009
 * Yep, done <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  15:15, September 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't mind spamming Nova as a MM.. Much ;o -- -Ch  ao  s-   15:58, September 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * A note to consider with Masochism is it can raise minions at a higher level than the caster if used with cons or a +1(20%) mod. The Vamps will also have a higher AL than the caster which is potentially undesirable. I think Masochism is worthwhile though.Xenomortis 18:05, September 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * masochism is in the build. &mdash; μαφλεσ 00:46, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * I can see that. I wasn't saying it should't be there or anything. I wasn't saying it should be there but wasn't, either.Xenomortis 10:13, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * so you just felt like telling us what masochism does in context with the build for the hell of it. &mdash; μαφλεσ 14:59, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * It's a note to consider and it hasn't been mentioned before. Is that a problem? Xenomortis 15:02, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * Xeno made a reasonable point, stop dem drama. -- -Ch  ao  s-   15:58, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * moo. obvious remark is obvious.  step 1: read skill description for masochism.  step 2: what does more points in death magic mean? durr wat &mdash; μαφλεσ 16:20, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * tbh, i wouldn't have guessed it makes your minions off higher AL then you are moo. Brandnew 16:29, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * Aye, t'was wat I meant. -- -Ch  ao  s-   17:27, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * if it's really a concern just take a shield, problem solved. &mdash; μαφλεσ 18:42, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

Is Mystic Regen alone enough to cover the health loss from OoU, BotM, and Masochism? If only there could be a N/D/Mo for both Mystic Regen and Dwayna's Sorrow... or just stick it on a hero Monk. -- <font color="#00aaff">WhiteAsIce 16:53, October 15, 2009 (UTC)
 * Or don't bring selfheals and have your heroes keep you alive. -- -Chaos- (talk) -- 10:24, October 16, 2009 (UTC)

Do heroes use this correctly?
title--173.66.203.20 17:03, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't post this here if you already posted it on gwwiki-- Relyk  talk  19:14, 20 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Answer the question.--173.66.203.20 04:04, 21 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Two sections up on the GWW page people said that heroes barely use OoU and it had to be micro'd. -- <font face="Courier New" color="Black">Toraen <font face="Courier New" color="DarkGoldenrod">TheJanitor [[image:ToraenSig2.png|link=User:Toraen]] 05:50, 21 April 2011 (UTC)

EBSoH
Should it be prioritized for the ranged or vamp minions? --JonTheMon 20:18, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Ranged. Faster attack speed.  Minion Minion_sig_k_bish.jpg 21:31, 25 July 2011 (UTC)