User talk:Rikk Panda/Sandbox/Build:GvG Holyshit Spike

So you took the bsurge out of namspike and put in a bad rit that deals less damage and does less support? Great job.--TahiriVeila 02:32, September 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * ThanksRikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 02:46, September 11, 2010 (UTC)

I don't understand expel. Hardly anyone is running all out hex and against trip melee it's useless. A bsurge or even empathic is better in every conceivable way.--TahiriVeila 20:55, September 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * I really don't want to explain my reasoning to someone who speaks in such absolutes. So I won't. I have physics homework to do. Rikk Panda  {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 00:43, September 12, 2010 (UTC)

Meh, v^2 = vi^2 + 2ad. There. I'll be fine on the test. (I digress) The Ritualist is there for the same reason behind this:. It offers more versatility and functionality through weapon spells. I also agree Empathic would be better in this meta. The rit takes pressure off of the Monks that are trying to keep the caller clean so he can spike cleanly.

The main reason (besides poor target calling) all dedicated spikes fail is because the spike isn't clean. Either the spikers can't spike, the caller is being shit on with all sorts of hexes and conditions and rupts, etc. I'm not saying your skills will never get rupted or fail or miss or anything like that, it's just that the goal is to minimize that possibility. Support Rit does that much better than Bsurge. You can't use Draw Conditions on a weapon spell, Bsurge can't run a support elite, and the rit maintains the damage while increasing versatility. If you compare:

Bsurge vs.
 * +Blind
 * +Weakness, Enchant removal
 * -Attunements will be stripped

Empathetic Rit
 * +Unstrippable prots in WoW and Resilient
 * +Cleans hexes
 * +Cleans conditions
 * +Party heal in Life and Kaoli
 * If not Kaoli, Li Ming, Mingson, another skill
 * +Ultimately take pressure off of the Monks. If the rit can use a skill on a monk that, normally, the monk would have to use on itself, then that monk can use that skill on another party member. A simple positive opportunity cost.

And then general caster counters that apply to both. Feel free to ask questions Rikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava}  01:15, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks you for showing you don't even come close to understanding why builds are chosen for the particular area that they are. The stand rit in rawrspike is to provide party healing and BIG SPIKE SUPPORT because the build already has tons of melee shutdown via water + mindwrack. Your rit bar is shit because it doesn't provide anything to the spike. You get that there's a difference between pure casterspikes (like this one) and balanced spikes(like rawrspike) right? In a pure spike build you need trons of melee shutdown because you don't have any warriors to lineback and cause adrenaline slow. In rawrspike your hammer war can just lineback all day long so your casters don't feal as much stress. That way you can dedicate your midline support char to party healing instead of adrenaline slow. In a pure spike build you have no lineback so YOU HAVE TO TAKE A CASTER DEDICATED TO SHUTTING DOWN PHYSICALS or they're just going to shit on you all day long. How the fuck do you think a whole squishy team is going to stay up when your only defense is a water ele and warding/resil? Warding is only good for keeping your prot monk from being spiked. A war sees warding/resil go up and he's immediatly hitting rush and swapping to a squishy target. Bsurge eles can watch the field and actively catch spikes. It's an actual line of defense, not a last-ditch lifeline for the backline like weapon spells have come to be. Fuck, take your shitty, poorly thought out tactics back to rank 500 and let obs mode teach you how to play. Don't tell the people who actually know what they're doing that they're wrong. I might not be the most technically proficient player out there, but i know builds, gameplay, mechanics, and theory inside and out.--TahiriVeila 01:29, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * And look bro, I know you're 17 and your frontal lobe hasn't finished developing so you're incapable of accepting that you're wrong in this instance. But please just try to accept it. I'm not going to get into a flamewar with you. I've explained to you why it's a bad choice. I'm not going to explain it again. If you try to vet this I will destroy it!--TahiriVeila 01:35, September 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ignoring the fact that 80% of what you said was mindless, situational nonsense, moreover rage-induced spit-filled blabbering, the insults have absolutely no effect on me (see: trollface.jpg). I find it hilarious that you feel so threatened by the absence of a blindbot. Maybe in your experience a Bsurge was necessary to shutdown melee, but it isn't. If the melee are giving you trouble, spike them. After all, it is a spike build. I think you spend way too much time speaking in generalizations without noting the intricacies of GvG; no matter how long of a paragraph you type, it is ultimately a waste of your time. Your attempt at an explanation was kind, but next time you should try harder. Rikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 01:58, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * zzzzzzzzzzzz How do you propose to kill wars without a strip? For that matter how do you propose to kill at all without a strip? Why take a rit when there's no advantage to it? You argue that a blindbot isn't necessary but you bring a rit that counters builds that aren't even a part of the meta (see expel). Zzz l2p--TahiriVeila 02:02, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Expel is no longer there, as per your suggestion. You can kill without a strip or rend, it isn't too difficult. Rikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 02:10, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Obv you've never played against a decent backline. That's okay. also, you realize that there's a massive logical contradiction in claiming that bsurges are bad b/c they can get stripped when you're running a spike dependent on two conjures and an SS rit, right?--TahiriVeila 02:13, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * In keeping with PvX-ness, the build doesn't factor in player skill. And no, there is no contradiction because the spike does not depend on those enchantments. They are generally superfluous. Keep trying, though. Rikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 02:24, September 12, 2010 (UTC)

So uh, how is this build supposed to kill anyone past rank 200? --Lemming 03:28, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Luck Rikk Panda {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 06:00, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * Now why is it that you admit you're wrong when lemlem says it's bad but not when I do? zzzzzz--TahiriVeila 06:16, September 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * you were raging about the absence of a Bsurge ele, he was talking about the build in general - and he's right. It's a gimmicky spike build, so most of the time, like all gimmicky spikes, it will epicfail. That's where player skill comes in, but it's rare to find coordinated teams Rikk Panda  {a.k.a. Benny Lava} [[Image:They're_On_Fire_Panda.jpg|19px]] 19:18, September 18, 2010 (UTC)