Archive talk:Rt/Mo Warmonger's Support

From previous build discussion

Archive 1

My opinion
Spirit light -> optional, optional -> spirit light, AoS. &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  22:40, 9 January 2008 (EST)

My opinion
I assumed good faith on all sides. But a bunch of mediocres haved dumped my asumption. My opinion is that:

Fact 1: A Great Build was submitted

Fact 2: Five days later a duplicated build is submitted.

Fact 3 and final: A bunch of mediocres dumped the first. Long life to the king.

Dont't waste time in comment anything more.

Chuki 02:07, 10 January 2008 (EST)


 * Can you see the difference between a merge and a delete? This was a merge. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 02:10, 10 January 2008 (EST)

lolwut
"never cast wmgrs on yourself 0.o nothing overextends that much" You can wand (spear) other casters just fine tbh. And lolwut? overextending? It's RA/TA. – Ichigo 724  08:13, 10 January 2008 (EST)

Someone care to explain where the equipment template went? 08:21, 10 January 2008 (EST)


 * It had radiant runes, lacked a minor spawning, etc. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 08:24, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Radiants? i coulda sworn i put on surviviors. but your right about the spawning rune. that was before a slight change, when it 12-12-3. i'll put up a new one tmrw.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 08:25, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Oh, I didn't test it, I assumed Chuki put it (with radiants) as the described equip had radiants. – Ichigo 724 [[Image:Ichigo-signature.jpg]] 08:26, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * twas mine, and mine *didnt* (i think) have radiants. but it was still inaccurate, and tmrw when i get on i'll paste in the new template.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 08:47, 10 January 2008 (EST)

Migraine does not often counter this build as you can pre-veil it.Daze does, however, kill this build as it cannot block or do anything to prevent daze/remove daze in a jiffy.  BaineTheBotter  08:31, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Preveil is only a counter for as long as you dont mess up.


 * Or your warrior with frenzy can with 33 IAS for more attacks? &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  15:41, 10 January 2008 (EST)

Aura of Stability
Dunno if this has been covered in the previous clusterfuck, but you REALLY need Aura in the main bar. Two heals is un necesarry, and Aura is possibly the single most vital TA skill at the moment. Ibreaktoilets 10:20, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Also, you need 14 channeling. The healing is not the main focus of this build, it assists in pressure and damage, as well as happening to carry a heal. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Ibreaktoilets 10:21, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * /agree, although enchant removal is also in the meta i believe.-- Shadow sin  11:02, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * I lied, attribute suicide?-- Shadow sin  11:05, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Making the opponent have to work to open a window of opportunuity for shutdown via KD is better than a 100% window. You drop Spawning and run 6 prot for a near constant AoS. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Ibreaktoilets 11:06, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Alternatively, you can drop healing to 10 and run 12-10-6-6. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Ibreaktoilets 11:13, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * resto nub -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 12:22, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Same thing tbh. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Tab  Moo  12:23, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * imo, Aura of Stability should be replaced with Blind was Mingson.--[[Image:Lann-sf2.jpg|19px|19px]] Lann 16:29, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * why?Bob fregman 20:18, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * 4 way split is not smart. You cannot use AoS on yourself. You already have points in restoration magic.--[[Image:Lann-sf2.jpg|19px|19px]] Lann 20:28, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * AoS is far more powerful than BwM, though. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 20:36, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Why would you need AoS on yourself? It's your monk that you don't want KDed. Besides, Spawning doesn't really matter. &mdash; Edru / QQ  20:36, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Like edru said, having you kd'd is np, but your monk(and balanced stance is only 14/30 secs), kd chain (good hammers can keep you down for 12 seconds to be honest) is /die. Aura is good. - [[Image:Unexist sig.jpg|20px]]Unexist  17:44, 11 January 2008 (EST)

also Bulls + Mindshock + Shock + Mindshock + dchop = lolwut &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  17:45, 11 January 2008 (EST)

running the 2 heal version in RA, i made 2 consecutive 10 win runs, the second resulting in flawlessign 4 TA's while being composed of a toucher and a shove sin. both times, no monk. this. build. owns. 00:42, 12 January 2008 (EST)

AoS is kinda opitional in RA, Spirit Light should replace it , Blind was Mingson and Weapon of Shadow should be in variants , i always use one of them in RA.--Drownz 18:09, 12 January 2008 (EST)
 * Skills are kinda optional in RA.Bob fregman 21:14, 13 January 2008 (EST)

Absolute bullshit removing the RA tag. Tycn is wrong. This build without a frontliner is still a better healer than most of the shit in RA. 09:26, 15 January 2008 (EST)
 * I disagree. For this build to run at maximum effectiveness, you need someone worth putting Warmonger's on, someone to cast Rage on and a monk to support. If you were to modify it for RA, you'd get a totally different build that happens to share an elite with this one. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Tab  Moo  09:29, 15 January 2008 (EST)
 * lose AoS and gain spirit light? even without a frontline character you still can easily carry teams with this. more than a few times now now i have gotten 10 wins with shitty teams on this, including a 2 in a row[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 09:43, 15 January 2008 (EST)
 * You can generally win with a bad team, against a bad team aslong as somewhere in your build you've got a heal or two. My point that this build really relies on a semi-decent frontline to work properly, something that you're rarely going to have in RA, you even have no frontline alot of the time. Once this build is reduced to 2 heals and a hex removal alot of the, it's not worth taking over any of the rit healer builds on here. If this was tagged for RA, alot of the votes would have to drop due to the fact that it can't perform well in all of the forms of PvP it is designed for. [[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets]]Tab  Moo  09:48, 15 January 2008 (EST)
 * Tab's right here. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 14:44, 15 January 2008 (EST)

Nerf
Warmonger's Weapon nerf, is the build still viable? Adr iaa nz 07:56, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * even with a 14 second down time i still think its a viable skill, we were asking for this nerf tbh.-- Shadow sin [[image:Shadowsin_sig.PNG]] 09:36, 18 January 2008 (EST)

What about Stability? At the least the Prot needs to be re-specced. It goes like 6 seconds after the nerf now. Light Cleric 11:03, 18 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yeah, the build should be re-specced. Aura doesnt last long enough imo.Bob fregman 14:58, 19 January 2008 (EST)

I changed it, feel free to change it again if i did it wrong.Bob fregman 15:06, 19 January 2008 (EST)

moar nerf
AoS was nerfed to 3...10 secs. either it should be changed or this be archived.-- AESTHE  T  I  C 
 * Just get rid of AoS its no longer viable.-- Shadow sin [[image:Shadowsin_sig.PNG]] 11:15, 24 January 2008 (EST)
 * Agree totally. Fusion 08:57, 25 January 2008 (EST)
 * It's still a vital skill. The question is how to get around the nerfs. I personally would rather have an AoS with 50% downtime than pretty much any other skill you could put on here. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 17:58, 25 January 2008 (EST)
 * you still need aos. It cant be mindlessly maintained, so now you kinda gotta be strategic and intelligent with your use of it, but like armond said, there arent a whole lote of skills that this could take that will be better then aos, even with its downtime.Bob fregman 21:50, 25 January 2008 (EST)
 * AoS is still fine, Warmonger's is still fine. this is like eviscerate befre the damage was reduced. still is TA on afk mode. still has the best damage assist in the game, still has an immortal spirit, still has insane energy, still rapes hexes, still heals.[[Image:Dark0805sig2.PNG]] 09:54, 29 January 2008 (EST)

RA
The build mentions RA and in the description and seem quite viable for RA, yet it has no tag. Should a RA tag be added? God box   10:54, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * I'd say no because it's designed around the idea of having a monk, a warrior, and a ranger or necro on the team, but that's just me. -- Armond Warblade[[Image:Armond sig image.png]] 14:51, 16 February 2008 (EST)
 * Would work better than other rit builds...--[[Image:Relyk Purifying Veil Sig.jpg|19px]]R ELYK   <font color="CCCCFF">(Talk  | <font color="99CCFF"> Edits)  06:19, 25 May 2008 (EDT)

Ancestors nerf
discuss. --Dark0805 ( Rant /<font color=#ff11aa>Contributions ) 09:25, 23 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Pay a bit more attention to rangers and it's still fine. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  09:29, 23 May 2008 (EDT)

Death Pact
Nerfed, I just replaced it with Res Sig, seeing as you shouldn't have run DPS in TA anyway. --<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  09:59, 23 May 2008 (EDT)

Warmongers+PRage Express
=sex? Anfunny 03:11, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

Spirit Transfer
I don't know how big the meta on KD is at the mo because I played some TA this afternoon and ended up dropping AoS in favour of Spirit Light because I just wasn't using it at all. Anyway point is if you were going to drop AoS instead of using Spirit Light would Spirit Transfer be better? If you accidentally killed your spirit you'd be stuffed seeing as the build relies heavily on it, but at least then if some warrior over extends like mad you can still give large healz at long range. IDK Saul Lachance 06:37, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

RA Testing
I was jolly-hopping around RA with this build for a while, for the lolz basically, and while it doesn't qualify for an RA tag (as that would probably drag the build to only 'good'), it's not horrendously bad and as was pointed out further up it's better than most rits. Anyway I was in this one match and this guy just EXPLODED at me basically for not being a monk. He was all "omg heal rit!" and I was like "I'm a running a freaking support build!" and he was like "MBaS + Spirit Light + Holy Veil?!?!?!?" and I was like "YEH SUPPORT NOT HEALING? Have you even LOOKED at the rest of my bar!?" at which point I broke down and was like "so where's your tankability anyway?!" and he started pinging his -60% DP at me and I just laughed at him for bringing no healing to RA where you can never count on getting any kind of healing. *Ahem* yeh anyway... Saul Lachance 12:11, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Cool story bro. Anfunny   Likes  [[Image:Lyssan-Monk.png|19px]]  Boys err... Girls.  02:34, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Lol, this is actually pretty awesome in RA but relies quite a bit on getting an attacker on your team. That said I've outhealed a lot of monks with it alone (though they were probably all bad monks admittedly) and you can always Warmonger's yourself. Tbh I don't think it's outdated at all but then that's just my opinion :-). 86.26.56.226 16:39, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Outdated or Updated?
Why has this been archived? There are still loads of untouched builds with OoS and/or Warmonger's which haven't been archived (two Good ones for TA with both) and tbh Warmonger's is as awesome as ever with a little Spawning. Furthermore there's at least one in trial (and one in testing for using Warmonger's, for RA admittedly, but WW actually works better in TA than RA). Now IMO the new Spirit Siphon is almost as good as OoS and not an elite, so I can see you might want to swap that in, and perhaps change some other things, I don't know, but it seems to me that this build should be getting an update at most, rather than being archived only so that a similar build with a similar name can pop up in its place in a week. 86.26.56.226 08:41, 21 June 2009 (UTC)