Archive talk:Any/W Hundred Blades Vaettir Farmer

lol, looks nice--Relyk 23:52, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

This vs Raptor Farming
I kinda want to see people's opinions on this. They kill similar amounts in similar times but they have distinct differences. To begin with, raptor farming kills a boss, which can yield elite tomes and passage scrolls (not that these are worth much though). In comparison, vaettirs drop glacial stones, which can be used for glacial gauntlets (but these arent worth much either). This doesnt require a certain professions, while raptor farming does (not worth much but is worth noting). From my experience and others talking about it, raptor farming seems to have a relatively high failure rate (~30% for the average person, needs confirmation) due to getting buttraped or interrupted or not getting enough adrenaline or something. This, however, is very consistent and has a low failure rate. A bad run would be where the aggro doesnt form a ball quickly and you only kill 20-25 vaettir, while with raptors u get nothing. If anybody wants to comment on this, it would be appreciated. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 00:14, October 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * Ermmm, more drops from vaetirs?--ValeV 00:49, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * Also different rep points. Spaggage  talk  01:18, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * True, different rep points, but if the average vaettir drops more than the average raptor, fuck raptor farming, this would pwn it. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 02:14, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * vaettirs take forever to ball but they do drop a lot of golds--Relyk 02:19, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * raptors drop a lot of golds too. Also, any prof can raptor farm, there are generic builds that work fine. Raptors get a bonus point for being able to merch your drops without having to run through an entire map over again. 68.48.197.219 07:52, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * Merch summoning stone! --Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 08:39, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

If it actually works.
I'm gonna test it today on my ranger with the appropriate runing and weapons. I'll check in later to tell the results. Shia78 08:46, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * I havent tested it on rangers, so if it doesnt work, sorry. Ive had success on my ele, but a ranger might have trouble with energy due to the low energy pool.  Although rangers do take half damage since their attacks are elemental. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 15:44, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks nice, I'll try it with my ele. But I have 2 questions: 1. is r5 enough? 2. is it in HM or NM? Fleshcrawler Soban 19:56, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * Hm. And i really dont know if r5 is enough.  It might be but the lowest ive tested it with is r8. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 20:12, October 31, 2009 (UTC)

Added a video, so u dont have to test for working-ness anymore. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 22:45, October 31, 2009 (UTC)
 * Posting a better quality and work video. I also do the South group, time to do both is ~2m20.Volko 19:26, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

warrior primary
can this be run on a warrior primary?
 * You would probably need full on radiant runes, but I don't see why not. -- Drah 17:58, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * You would also need an energy giving off-hand (no shield) because u need a little less than 40 energy for this to work and warriors can only get 20 (base) + 8 (insignias) + 5 (sword) = 33, so the 6 from an off-hand is required. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 20:35, November 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * Attunement runes exist. Weapon swaps are possible. A warrior can have as much as 50 energy by simply carrying a staff(Insightful with Seize the Day) in an alternate weapon slot. Run around with your sword and shield set, swap to staff and activate your skills, and swap to sword for Whirlwind. MisterB 20:23, May 22, 2010 (UTC)

Works
It does work, and can yield some decent results, however, I think the wolf caves are better farm with a slightly longer run for both loot and norn points.
 * What wolf caves? Kveldulf? They take way too long to get to and there are many fewer of them. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 20:25, November 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * Wolfs=fail... varretais farm takes abou 1 min 30secs and can rezone for speed. compared to wolf farming u would have to resign to gunnars and run to the cave again. -- Elf-eElf.jpg 12:25, November 9, 2009 (UTC)

fun, Fun, FUN, FUN!!!!!--68.227.202.180 22:30, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

Having problems with this one
Im trying to do this on my sin and Spell breaker keeps running out before they group. My hero has +4 divine. Anyone got some tips?
 * Make sure you have Blessed Aura up on your hero. You need to disable and manually cast it. Spaggage  talk  20:11, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * Why bother with spell breaker just take breeze for coditioning--- X  TREME 22:37, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hexes... Particularly clumsiness. ---  Ressmonkey  (talk) 23:06, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * X showing us how pro he is once again. Spaggage  talk  23:09, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * meh for one attack....give me a break. lrn to time attacks. To each there own.--- X  TREME 23:52, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * 36 vaettir spamming clumsiness on recharge. You will never get an attack off. Life   Guardian  23:55, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * guess I was jus lucky then--- X  TREME 00:51, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * ups I was doing it in 2 groups...thought 36 was high.---<font color="#0000ff"> X <font color="#696969"> TREME 11:33, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Wow saw video how come I don't have that many Vaettir?---<font color="#0000ff"> X <font color="#696969"> TREME 11:38, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * If you have some quest active less spawn. --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 11:47, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Blood Washes Blood, iirc. You need to finish it, abandoning doesn't work either. --Brandnew 14:14, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * c, you need to complete Blood Washes Blood. Spaggage  talk  14:39, March 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * IF you already completed it can you then abandon it?---<font color="#0000ff"> X <font color="#696969"> TREME 17:44, March 8, 2010 (UTC)

For warrior
What optional skill should a warrior use? Cause of the low energy it's hard to use energy skills. "Some Other Shitterr" 15:24, March 10, 2010 (UTC) &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by Some Other (talk &bull; contribs).
 * Although I havent tested it, maybe use bonettis defense and shield stance. Use Soldiers defense to gain adrenaline for bonettis, use skills until your energy drops to a low amount, hit bonettis, gain enough energy, switch to shield stance and finish the chain.  Hopefully that will work, reply if it doesnt. --- <font color="Blue"> Ressmonkey  (talk) 20:41, March 10, 2010 (UTC)

Any tips?
I do this on my sin but Im having trouble maintaining spell breaker until they all go close to me...it seems like it runs out before there all there and i die.. i also cast the other monk enchantment on the monk. Any tips for it? Thanks--Braxton619 22:44, March 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * You dont have to wait for them all to ball because that doesnt always happen. When spell breaker is about to end, kill what you can, pick up ur drops, die, and rezone.  If you are having trouble killing any, skip a group thats too far away to get some extra time. --- <font color="Blue"> Ressmonkey  (talk) 23:01, March 15, 2010 (UTC)

Heroes = Less drops?
I doubt this seriously. When I have heroes and if I forget to flag them, I get very little drops, usually next to nothing, BUT, if you flag them out of the loot range, there's an obvious difference in drops.

So when we talk about loot there are several theories about it, has to do with loot scaling(anti-farm code), generation, and assignment. There is are some arguments that loot drops(loot assignment) are better when you kill slower, however, the data on this from the discussions really show an extremely slow kill rate, which can't applied to raptors or vaettirs because even the slowest method is faster than the loot graph shows.

Secondly, golds, dye's, scroll, rare drops are not involved in (loot scaling), so having more or less people in your group shouldn't change the loot GENERATION. And if assignment depends on rate of kill, then see above paragraph.

It is felt that loot GENERATION occurs at the point where you enter the map, a generally accepted theory.

So, zone into map, loot has been generated, loot assignment occurs when you kill the mob which is subject to scaling (if non-rare), otherwise it depends on who is in the loot range. And if they are not in the loot range, they are not part of the determination of assignment.

So, if there is loot(depending on the loot generation), it is either assigned to you, or no one(in which case nothing drops).

Since the most important loot tends to be gold drops, dye's, tomes, scrolls, etc -> things not subject to loot scaling, having party members as leechers do not affect your rate of return other than assisting you on zoning/speeds.

Etc.

Please Discuss, As far as I know, this is how the whole farming thing works(in theory).--Hallaloolah 21:36, April 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * Everything you need to know is found here. Hero's affect drops.  There is also a debate aboutif you kill monsters all at the same time then drops don't get triggered....not to sure on that one.---<font color="#0000ff"> X <font color="#696969"> TREME 12:28, April 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Correction, heroe's affect drops if they are within loot assignment range. Just go raptor farming about 20 times, and just let your heroes go in with you, and other times flag them by the shrine like the leechers do and...see the difference.  Clearly, hero slots are treated similarly to player slots.  If a player decides to run on in with you on a raptor farm, they get drops.  The difference is those drops assigned to the heroes do not show up as they are automatically taken out.

This is the graph from the kill rate argument: http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k300/Nechtan_Thaumaturge/drop_rate.png

Do you really think that you will wait as long as 20 seconds between each kill to gain this advantage? For 60 vaettirs that 1200 seconds, or for 34 raptors, that 680 seconds. --Hallaloolah 13:48, April 3, 2010 (UTC)

Friday May 21, 2010 Update
I have noticed that after this update, the Vaettirs now try to use an additional spell, Mind Wrack. This causes the monsters to ball slower so i always die, unless i get a 1/100 spawn. And yes, i do have 16 divine favor and +20% ench. on my hero. Has anyone else noticed this? --y0ggi 09:26, July 17, 2010 (UTC)
 * They do seem to take a lot longer to ball up... I found that the only way to be able to do it properly is ignore the group that will take the longest time to get to so you only aggro 32 but it still works if you do that. --- <font color="Blue"> Ressmonkey  (talk) 19:19, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

N/W
I think this is a viable N/W build. I left out Mark of Pain since the video doesn't require it either and kills them all just fine.

Anybody think that's a poor choice of skill suggestions for the Necromancer variant? Angueo 02:20, August 24, 2010 (UTC) so life stealing would be a good investment.
 * Going once... Angueo [[Image:AngueoSignature.jpg|19px]] 23:09, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * The thing is that neither of the necro skills actually help much. Blood bond (if its not removed quickly by expel hexes) will really only heal you when theyre all dead when theres no point to being at full health.  Demonic flesh will add a little damage but not much.  I looked through the necromancer skills and the only skill I would find that would be pretty useful would be enfeebling blood, reducing damage quite a bit (but the health sac isnt so nice).  Then, taking another warrior skill like shield stance or dolyak signet would work.  But, really, my solution and yours would be worse than any of the other professions options, so unless the only character somebody has developed at all is their necro, it doesnt serve much purpose to have a necro variant. Ressmonkey 23:33, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * Where is the Expel Hexes coming from? Also, Blood Bond is more useful because it's life stealing, so it's not "adding" damage, it allows you to steal life completely ignoring armor and according to the wiki:
 * "These creatures have a remarkably high armor rating, estimated to be somewhere between 160 and 170."
 * The only other better investment would be Mark of Pain, but as I said the video didn't need it, and this probably won't either.
 * That build posted was awhile ago and I didn't see it until I checked again because people were talking, but "To The Limit!" would probably be better like this:

Angueo 01:09, September 22, 2010 (UTC)

Easymode
Run without 20% enchanting for SB monk, time your WW properly and you get 36 / <1:10 runs every time <font color="#220000">ICY <font color="#550000"> F <font color="#990000">IFT <font color="#550000">Y <font color="#220000">FIVE  16:44, September 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * I dont get it. Why would you want less time on spell breaker and what is WW? Ressmonkey 00:33, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * If SB runs out, you get hit with hexes, AI dictates not to renew a hex until it's gone so they ball up and hit you in melee at which point you wait for clumsiness to end and you WW (whirlwind attack) 24.78.142.37 03:10, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok, just tested it and it works. I was thinking they would accumulated pain spike you, but for some reason they dont use it.  If you want to add it as a variant go ahead. Ressmonkey 15:13, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
 * Added it, tell me if I did something wrong :P <font color="#220000">ICY <font color="#550000"> F <font color="#990000">IFT <font color="#550000">Y <font color="#220000">FIVE  17:12, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Dmg output for warrior
I just can't get the dmg up enough to kill anything, i'm running the warrior build on this with all the recommended equip and stats...suggestions?
 * Might be low Ebon Vanguard rank or not aggroing enough. You should have at least r5 and at minimum aggro 28 of the vaettir. Ressmonkey 21:22, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

After BuH Nerf
Does this still work? Will test it out, I have r10 vanguard though so it may not be the most effective test. 24.186.229.141 18:22, 20 February 2011 (UTC) I test with r10 vanguard and had success. Just have to ball them up correctly. Is there another skill to replace BuH? Any skill...
 * AoS for recharge and shit (double exp as well), though only the right side is possible, the left side doesn't have enough foes for enough damage (unless you are doing this on a warrior).– BalisticSig.png<font color="#7777cc">alistic 01:17, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The build info needs to be updated becuz of the BuH most of them are probably out of date Dacookiemaster 14:42, 23 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Does anyone even run this anymore? Dacookiemaster 17:28, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Confirmed for not working anymore on R/W due to not enough damage-- GWPirate 关 20:07, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
 * What was your ebon rank and how many Vaettir did you have balled? -- Toraen   confer  20:11, 3 February 2012 (UTC)
 * All the northern side vaettir and r9 ebon.-- GWPirate 关 11:01, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Ok, after trying this with effectively max Ebon rank I only succeeded when I could gather all 36 northern vaettir. A lot of the time, you won't be able to do this and have them settle during Spell Breaker's duration. So it is now archived. -- Toraen   confer  16:53, 14 June 2012 (UTC)