Archive talk:Team - Sway

this is the new meta. 67.162.10.70 18:04, 8 March 2008 (EST)

Didn't PA nerf kill it? ▪  √ēт   [no :D u]  18:28, 8 March 2008 (EST)
 * No. Belgianbronco [[Image:BelgianbroncoMesmerSig.png]] 21:20, 11 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Forgot Well of Profane, it was ran todayStreetlight 21:35, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

The real meta version has a Rt/Me running expel hexes, not Rt/Mo. There aren't 4 R/D, but 3 R/D with a spike trapper and a smoke trapper. Also, both N/Rt healers are supposed to be using Wail of Doom as their elite. --M3atwad 00:33, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

this is the version that i always run with lots of success--Jboy157
 * Observer mode ftw.. fail less pl0x. ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  05:16, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

I would use Expel Hexes instead of Divert hexes. Natsopaani 08:53, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

This build uses tranquility+NR and uses enchants, that's pretty much fail. Go Rt/Me take Expel hexes, Arcane Echo, protective was w/e that dude is and generic heal like MBAS, or soothing memories for e-management. You can guess what arcane echo is for :/

Trappers
how many trappers should there be? 1 or 2? plz give ur opinion--Jboy157

one, but with a song of concentration instead of natural stride. Didi 08:21, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Yay, many new users recently... Frans  10:30, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Useless Spotless Mind on the Rit ftw. It lasts 1 sec and activates after 5. GG Dr4goN ( talk /pvxcontribs ) 10:58, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * No. It removes a hex when it end aswell.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 11:04, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Grr! Edit conflict! Was about to say that. ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  11:05, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Oath Shot?
Know it's not what the meta runs, but how would a Oath Shot spirit spammer do in this? - Star Seeker  |  My talk  12:35, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Maybe, but the condition pressure really helps the team. I guess extra spirits wouldn't hurt since the N/Rt's could use them to fuel heals.  I'd replace the spike trap ranger if you really wanted to spam. [[Image:mightymouse.gif|25px]] moush$2+2=4$  00:08, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The elite traps matter more than the spirits. Completely sacrificing the trap for costly spirit upkeep really isn't worth it. The traps make most of the difference between winning or losing, spirits just irritate people.
 * They aren't even necessary anymore tbh; with the insanely imba Rending Touch removing channeling from monks every single time they put it up, Tranq isn't needed. And because general prot (SB/PS/SoA) fails hardcore against shitway since they hit 3 targets at once anyway, NR isn't a huge boon. - Auron 00:21, 31 March 2008 (EDT)

good
Gay but works well himynameisbobbyjoe 13:02, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Trappers/Expel
after much use of this build, i have learned the best way to run is with 3 r/d, 1 smoke trap, 1 spike trap, 1 expel and 2 n/rts
 * your 3 r/ds can take lightning reflexes instead of spirits, and your 2 n/rts are good.

Smoke Trapper [build prof=Ranger/Paragon Expertise=12+1 Wilderness=12+1+1][Smoke Trap][Dust Trap][Flame Trap][Barbed Trap][Trapper's Speed][Tranquility][Song of Concentration][Resurrection Signet][/build]

Spike Trapper [build prof=Ranger/Elementalist Expertise=11+1 Wilderness=11+1+1 Earth=8][Spike Trap][Dust Trap][Flame Trap][Barbed Trap][Trapper's Speed][Nature's Renewal][Grasping Earth][Resurrection Signet][/build]

then of course an expel rit instead of that stupid dh rit. the expel is the normal build with expel, arcane echo, splinter, warmongers, bloodsong, empowerment, flesh

And TaDah! We got a Modded Sway! w00t, gogo farm HA. -_-. ≈Display    ≈Spam Me  13:26, 12 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Woah! Grasping Earth on a trapper, thats genius! [[Image:Huynh_sig.jpg‎ ]]  Huynh Sanity  21:48, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Even though i absolutely hate this, it works.Extreme 22:36, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

Grasping earth + NR won't work. They're past you when you're gonna cast grasping if you have NR up. —ǘŋ Ɛxɩsƫ  05:14, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It depends on the skill of the player. A good player should be able to see a melee charging the back line, and time GE accordingly. Although this is pretty easy to run, it does require SOME skill lol. And besides, even if you fail epicly at timing GE, stand where the traps trigger so that when they get knocked down from spike, u can cast easily. And if trapper doesnt put spike around the monks he fails anyways. Gabe 17:35, 20 March 2008 (EDT) Gabe
 * The point is, a runner with make haste + no snares on him could avoid GE like half of the time, nearby range isn't that big.  —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  13:52, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Ah, sry I misunderstood you. I see your point, and it is quite vaild; but my guess would be that the trapper refrains from using NR while on the relic map, but perhaps im wrong. And, although there are many counters, the R/D's have snare now, so if just one lands then GE can be placed, if the trapper is on his toes. But once again, i see another problem here: non-scrub monks should have their fingers ready to fire away at hexes and conditions. So altogether, this could be a problem under those circumstances. Good point, sry i misunderstood u at first. Gabe 20:29, 14 April 2008 (EDT)

WS
removed 6 points from wilderness.. No skils linked to it, unnecesary. Exper ienced 00:34, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

Sway
That's what I've seen people call it. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō) [snō hwīt tăn]  03:59, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Short for shitway, the nickname from back when thumpers were still used. The r3s that run it think it means spiritway. - Auron 04:13, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Rofl. Don't talk bad about Sway, what's the Noobs supposed to run now when Iway is gone. ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  05:21, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Balanced so they get better at the game, and get in real teams that run real builds and hold halls to get real fame? :/ - Auron 06:19, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Do you really think they can run Balanced rofl ^^. ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  06:21, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * No, but at least then I could beat them quicker instead of having to spirit hunt first. - Auron 06:50, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Lmao! That's true :). ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  07:03, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Lmao, look at u 2. Everyone starts somewhere.  Elitists ack thpt!
 * What?.. Sign by typing " ~ ". Yes, everyone starts somewhere, but doesn't mean that they have to start with gay crap like Euro Hex, Iway, Sway, or old school ViMway. [[Image:Mesmer-tango-icon-200.png|20px]] Display  文  wtb mes tomes  03:25, 15 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Please tell what people have to do otherwise. Low ranked people don't have guilds and experienced people to back them up, what else do you espect? SniperFox 07:55, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Auron has already said it. They try balanced and play that, so they get better at the game because it takes skill and improves you. I'd rather take an r3 who balanced 180 fame than an r6 who sway'd 1000. Rawrawr  07:57, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The problem is that there is no way as a low ranked to find a decent group who can run balanced, and there is no way to find a decent guild who lets you go with them. And to that, to the avarage group, the rank means more than actual skill involved. The problem is that HA is more fame farming than actual PvP these days, sadly. SniperFox 08:42, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * There is more then enough noobs complaining about in id1 at any given time for them to put together their own unranked group, or form their own guild, etc. Its not that they can't, its that they don't. Gosu Death &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.132.22.124 (contribs).
 * The elitist attitude in HA prevents unranked players from joining any team, unless there is no skill involved and people think it won't do any harm. Thus, this team was created. 145.94.74.23 10:05, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * No, this team was created became popular because bad players didn't like getting better. They just wanted something that let them auto-win. It's sort of the reason why Ursanway is so popular in PvE, even though it isn't as fast or safe as a balanced team that doesn't suck. - Auron 10:10, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * People need to be more industrious. If you and a bunch of other people are the targets of Elitism in HA, then why wouldn't you form a great big guild of "losers" and just play HA with a spike/lego/balanced/whatever until you're good at it? Not like you can't obs other people and derive the builds. It even shows damage etc so you can work out what attribs they're using. Sway is purely for farming fame. It has nothing to do with getting good at HA or learning anything. When you finally do get your R8 and someone invites you, you're only going to get kicked you because you have no idea what you're doing because you only know Sway. - PANIC!  [[Image:panic_sig3.gif|20px]]  pewpewpew!  10:20, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * I laugh at Sway. For the first 3+ rounds, we will stab you in the face and then walk away laughing. After that usually it's the AB arena and that one just sucks a giant hairy one.--204.10.221.253 16:39, 10 April 2008 (EDT)

Test....
I Started 8:00 AM Rank 0.... Toke spike trapper,found team.Won 4 times in a row,won against Boissons En Colere, and went HoH, in less then 1 hour. Today, i'm rank 4,got acepted in HA Guild and won twice HoH.I love u man
 * LMFAO!! Fail less please lmfao. ≈Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  ≈Spam Me  17:37, 13 March 2008 (EDT)


 * lol you beat french people no accomplishment whatsoever &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  18:50, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * :).  №1 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  中Spam Me  18:50, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * FRENCHIES CAN'T PLAY HA BECAUSE THEY'RE TOO BUSY EATING CREPES AND FIXING THEIR BERETS!!! --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  18:55, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * no theyre just gay &mdash;  Skadiddly [슴Mc슴] Diddles  18:56, 13 March 2008 (EDT)


 * I disagree. He's amazing. He beat the french using a build called "Escape Way." Talk about beating someone at their own game XD [[Image:Ni_sig.JPG|50x19px]]Ni 18:59, 13 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Learn history imo. Moush 15:50, 15 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It's retarted lame shit that require 0 skills(except for bashing and rending touch spam). This again, is why ha-rank doesn't say shit. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  05:13, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * HA Rank never ment skill in the first place, it only ment how mutch time you spend in HA. SniperFox 07:53, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Not really. So do you say that Spartan, Lego etc don't got skill? Don't think so. [[Image:Mesmer-tango-icon-200.png|20px]] Display  文  wtb mes tomes  08:23, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The rank just doesn't mean how mutch skill someone has. I for example did ALOT of GvG long ago but i didn't do HA. Now i just don't have the time it takes to HA but i can safely say i have more skill than the avarage R3. Then add to that, that people can just ebay an account with a high rank, or if they have friends who let them go with high ranked groups. Its more about luck and the time spend in HA than actual skill, especially with all these new gimmick builds going around. Guilds and groups requiring ranks from low ranked players only support the gimmick behaviour. SniperFox 08:40, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Aye, I totaly agree with you, r1-6 dosen't mean a shit these days. For example, I have a friend who logged on his firends r9 account and got into a guild, he ran Sway 24/7 for about 1 month. He's r8 now, almost r9, and still fails epicly. [[Image:Mesmer-tango-icon-200.png |20px]] Display  文  wtb mes tomes  08:45, 16 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Lol. I'm r2 (somewhere around 100 fame) but I got all of it through balanced builds or Randomway o_O. My rankless PUGS beat r3-6 groups of: zerg (before nerf), heroway, rspike, escapeway, balanced, smiteball.. (even though in my mind that win didn't mean crap.) I just run a HB or WoH monk and start up PUGs when I'm bored. I agree with SniperFox on the fact that "it's more about luck and the time spent in HA than actual skill." Fighter From Cantha 17:15, 18 March 2008 (EDT)
 * You were VS Frenchises.. r6 Frenchies..  文 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  wtb mes tomes  17:41, 18 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Spartan takes a lot of skill...true it's easy if you play it right, but it takes a lot of co-operation and the ability to think.--204.10.221.253 16:41, 10 April 2008 (EDT)
 * GANK guys are good, but not great. It's just that they play at lame times where they hold 10+ times cuz of 1v1. Isn't that hard then, when it's KOTH 1v1. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  07:30, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Logical.
Isn't it more logical to change the order from Chilling Victory, Pious Assault, to Pious Assault and then Chilling Victory. Due the fact the foe(s) will have a deep wound and thus less health so you have more chance to apply the bonus damage from Chilling Victory? Roxas XIII 03:21, 18 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Pious assualt is used after chilling in order for dw to be more devastating. For example, if 2 of the dervs target a monk, if both chillings hit, then at least one of them should trigger the conditional damage. Then, applying DW would cause a dramatic loss in health, resulting in a better spike. Gabe 17:29, 20 March 2008 (EDT) Gabe
 * Wrong. DW before is better. It's just cuz pious assault used 2 be 1/2, so it's good followup. Now you'd rather pious -> chilling. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  14:04, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Rather have Pious -> Eremites, to trigger Deepwound faster. Chilling can go first unless they're bunched, then it's better if you make sure about the Condi. damage.  69.157.64.199 01:52, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * True. But still; you should use eremites alot. Rly alot. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  07:32, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Necessary?
I was just looking at the Expel bar, and why is arcane on there? It seems somewhat random. Obviously it's intended for warmongers, but is it really that vital? Or is it meant as some kind of utility in case empowerment gets taken down? I'm just wondering because I feel that perhaps a better skill could fill the slot. Either way it seems sub-par imo. Please, correct me if I'm wrong ^^ Gabe 02:31, 20 March 2008 (EDT) Gabe
 * its for warmongers weapon, not expel hexes WW is the best ever. No sub-par-ness there. >_>--74.61.209.219 02:35, 20 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Double warmongers is quite nice, or rather fucking nice. God  box   17:38, 20 March 2008 (EDT)

Double warmongers is nice. You can also use it to keep up splinters on all three R/Ds. Or, if you're facing hexway, you can copy expel. Its usage depends mainly on where you're fighting and who you're fighting.

Best gimmick there is?
Rly? It can beat anything with ease? Had no clue about this till now, me has found wut title to grin now then. -- g r g r   06:32, 22 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Its nowhere near as good as any of the recently nerfed lamegays. Rawrawr  07:44, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

FomF
Take Well of blood instead of FomF, res on healer = fail.
 * Are you gonna start cry about this gay crap after everyone have rated this 5-5-5? GG. Only 1 Hard ress is fail, need Flesh on the Nrt.  文 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  wtb mes tomes  18:36, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

Necro's
WoR sucks ass when you have mend body and soul. It's a waste. —ǘŋ Ɛxɩsƫ  14:02, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It sucks because it removes weapon of warding, not because of mend body. Watch me work it 17:51, 25 March 2008 (EDT)
 * WoR is one of the worst N/Rt elites because it kills WoW. I've wiped loads of sways/hways faster purely cuz their n/rt removes WoW with it. Rawrawr  07:29, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

I agree. Preservation is probably better choice of an elite. Master Gladius
 * You're joking, right? Lord Belar 12:41, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * WoD imo. [[Image:mightymouse.gif|25px]] moush$2+2=4$ 12:59, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * ^ Seconded. 2 N/Rts using WoD shuts down any balanced with ease. When pugging, it's recommended to bring a WoP instead of a wail though, for better energy management. WoR should be replaced with WoD, but at the very least WoD should be noted as a variant. --M3atwad 16:42, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * WoD or IV. WoR is just kinda meh for N/Rt's. --[[image:GoD Sig3.jpg|20px]] Guild of  Deals  16:45, 30 March 2008 (EDT)

Pres is best. Rawrawr 16:54, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * I could agree with IV, adds nice spike potential when an R/D is all over someone. WoR and Pres are a nono. Pres is completely overshadowed by rejuvenation and recuperation (and recovery for that matter). No need for pres when you have these up and decent healers. WoR, as stated before, removes much needed splinter and warmonger's, and warding when on casters. There's no reason for you to waste elites on skills that are already being covered by non elites.--M3atwad 01:28, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Pres or WoR. IV is shit, the build doesn't spike. Rejuvenation is simply bad. Recuperation is sort of like pres but is 20 more energy and doesn't heal as much. - Auron 01:30, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Okay so me and my guild ran this over the weekend. We modded it, with great succes, as follows: one Escape thumper instead of an R/D (no pet, just hammer KDs, bulls strike, FGJ, etc) and because WoR/WoP/Pres are complete and total garbage in this build (and because they are simply not needed if your healers are somewhat decent), Wail of Doom on both the N/Rt. Wail can be used offensively or defensively, depending on what you're facing. You can own incoming A/Ds in the face with it, bye bye spike. Chain it on the snarer during relic runs, bye bye snares. Chain it on a healer when you don't need it defensively... etc. Also, it proved quite nice to turn this build into resway at times. Fuck grasping and song of concentration, put a hard res (FomF or DPS) on both trappers, both n/rt and the weapon rit and nothing will get you down :) [[Image:Riven-sig.png]]   12:16, 1 April 2008 (EDT)

Nerf ?
With the increasing number of idiots running this there is no doubt going to be a nerf soon but on what ? Expertise is quite overpowered and so is the damage scythe attacks do. Anet should be encouraging noobs to actually try and get real teams together instead of running this thoughtless crap and not actually getting better at the game. Bakari 20:58, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It took them longer than a few weeks to nerf IWAY, don't think this will be gone so soon. It's not really that imba, it's just annoying as hell. [[Image:mightymouse.gif|25px]] moush$2+2=4$ 23:33, 30 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It really is that imba. Traps are the biggest problem with it; they need to hit a single target. I mean, seriously; when was the last time you saw a bear trap clamp on the legs of four bears at once?
 * Scythes are imba and always have been. No weapon should crit for 120+ damage without an attack skill. On top of scythe damage being ridiculous, Pious Assault is simply imbalanced. It was "balanced" with Dervishes in mind - dervishes usually have an enchantment and completely lack expertise, so it was assumed the drawback was potent. Rangers never have enchantments on them and have expertise to lower the cost to nothing, so the conditional drawback simply doesn't exist.
 * And then there's Rending Touch. That's simply the most broken skill on the entire bar. It's been broken forever, and has been used accordingly; hell, people dropped shock on W/E's in favor of rending on a W/D bar. When you can strip every single attune, channeling, and healer's boon that the other team throws up, you know you have a broken skill. - Auron 00:32, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * In no way is it imba. Hexpressure tears sway apart, and the new rit spike that uses gust and spirit rift is simply the best counter you can have. Not to mention that just in sway vs sway fights, bringing banishing strike and wail of doom is gg, wail will kill the R/D's energy when they have 0 expertise, not to mention escape lasts 1 second, and banishing takes out clumps of spirits with ease. Quit crying nerf.--M3atwad 01:24, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * So to beat it, you need to specifically build against it? Sounds like imba to me. --71.229.204.25 01:40, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Yeah, it sort of sounds like you either run hexway (which is another overpowered gimmick) or you lose. Balanced? Obviously. - Auron 06:17, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Golem Factory. Rusty 06:19, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * QFT &mdash;  Skakid  08:50, 31 March 2008 (EDT)


 * I agree this is pretty much IMBA, but you can beat this with: Legoway, any kind of spike, Hexway and pretty much with all balanced teams. Just don't fail and you'll win.  文 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  wtb mes tomes  06:52, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Legoway, except the traps kill your frontline/midline/backline and the mes sits on his ass most of the time with nothing to PD outside of echo... any kind of spike minus paragons and rspike, because shitway has wowarding/escape/lightning reflexes... and balanced teams which suffer the same problems as legoway. Hexway is the only way to reliably beat it, and even that build starts to lose the second smoke trap lays down.
 * It simply isn't balanced. It provides too much pressure at a total lack of skill. You don't need to be good to stand still and press 1-2-3-4 to spread conditions to entire other teams (the HA map design does it for you), the R/D's just cspace (literally, none of them have a clue about targeting or pressuring) and spam rending touch on recharge; the n/rt's take about as much skill as they always have... not a bunch. Oh, and the rit spams weapon skills on recharge, no need to time it or call it on vent or anything; he just puts warmongers up on two scythe tards and they interrupt with every hit. No, the build isn't balanced. If it required even the least bit of skill I could maybe see someone having a solid argument describing it as balanced, but until then, it is simply broken. - Auron 08:12, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Yes it is broken but. Legoway can win. PD Weapons, Pargons train the trappers/spirit hunt = gg. Rspike.. Anthem of guide ftw.  文 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  wtb mes tomes  08:18, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Anthem of guidance is utter trash. If you have to sacrifice an actually good elite to take guidance, you're building specifically against shitway; proving it's imbalanced. Paragons train the trappers through blind and lightning reflexes/natty strike/wowarding/song of conc? Uh... no. They can get most of them, but as soon as they target something else for the spike or as soon as the smoke trap concs, its over.
 * Legoway can win if it's run by a r9+ team. A regular rank 5-7 team (with vent) running legoway will still lose to an unranked shitway that isn't even on vent. How balanced is that? Oh... it isn't.
 * I'm not saying it's impossible to beat this. I just finished holding halls for over an hour, fighting pretty much only shitway; but the effort required to win and the pressure that build puts out is too much for the non-existent skill of the players running it. It is, in essence, the best of gimmicks; it is the all-encompassing crutch that gets around how terrible the players are that run it. When unranked teams without vent actually win against anything organized, you know the build is broken. - Auron 08:26, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * To summarize recent comments: Sway owns pretty much everything, regardless of players. God  box   08:42, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * I wonder how they'll berf this. Probably the trappers... Who knows?  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 08:44, 31 March 2008 (EDT)

I remember how Godliest (7 fame) and me (1 fame) got to beat quite some teams with this...  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ  08:46, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * I got 16!!!!!! FFS! Q_Q But we beat some Taiwan ranked guild playing Hexway, flawless :P God  box   08:55, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Run balanced and become good at the game imo &mdash;  Skakid  08:58, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The reason why there is so much sway and gayway is that it is impossible to get into a balanced team to learn to play properly until you've farmed with some gayway to get to R3. Maybe more guilds need to have some other way of getting people into HA, like a development squad or something where they hold trials with TA pugs to find people who don't completely suck ass, then teach them to play. Considering how painfully bad TA pugs are, this will melt peoples brains and make them cry blood. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  09:02, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Although, that being said, during the double fame weekend there were people party searching for R8 and 9+ sway. People like farming stuff like this, although I have no idea why, it's like glad point farming in RA or anything, stupid. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  09:03, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * I did a bit of heroway because of lack of people and the high fame farm (since people I was playing with weren't good enough to get far =P) since you only need 6 people. I've yet to run R/D way, balanced is more fun and if you're in a bad mood you can shit talk the shitters running their shit builds when you win. Plus, you're getting better at the game. &mdash;  Skakid  09:07, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * You don't get into any balanced with 16 fame though, they require at least R3 and so do the most Sway groups too. Saw someone in need of a r11+ too :P God  box   09:09, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * The guild I am in is from when I lived in another country. Now I live in Euro timezone and no one is ever online when I am. I used to be in an even smaller guild so HA was totally out of the question. I have ONCE managed to get together enough ALLIANCE members to HA with, we lost once, we won once, lost once, then everyone QQed and quit except for me and one other guy. Me and that other guy then spent an hour building up a balanced PuG in HA using teamspeak. Our callers microphone failed in the middle of the match so we lost pretty badly, against sway actually, the caller left because he saw no point if he couldn't call, the team evaporated. We didn't want to spend another hour trying to rebuild a balanced team. I don't have enough fame to get into a HA team, my only hope would be to farm some gayway until R3, then try and find a balanced guild, assuming I wanted to quit my current guild. That is why people sway and gayway, although I'll probably just try to build up a core TA team or something from people who don't care what titles people have and don't suck, that could take a while. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  09:14, 31 March 2008 (EDT)

I hope they don't nerf this, almsot all naps run it and almost never lose from it, even Golemway rapes this apart(except cap points)Just play with brains and you wont lose from brainless. Watch me work it 11:02, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * If they do nerf it, it will most likely be something to do with expertise affecting non-ranger skills, or maybe scythes. Rending touch will mostly likely get a recharge nerf and maybe cost increase.  Trappers aren't as much of a problem as the whole build is. Trappers aren't really effective unless they're in gimmick builds like this or condition heavy teams. [[Image:mightymouse.gif|25px]] moush$2+2=4$  20:44, 31 March 2008 (EDT)
 * Cost increase wouldn't do SHIT to this. That would only hurt Dervishes who used this. And Warriors. But I think they will nerf it so that Exp. only affects Ranger Attack Skill.  12:24, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Yeah, that's the most obvious nerf. The only build that really benefits from Expertise, working for any attack skill, is this one. And dagger Rangers, but come on.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 12:27, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * I agree with that they will nerf expertise, but just not that. They will also nerf a/d stuff(it´s just freaking lame m8), and buff dervishes up a bit(mysticism is a bit underpowered except for orders). —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  07:35, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Most likely nerf i see is against Escape. IMHO change it so that it it ends as soon an attack skill is (or even an attack) is used. That way it can still serve the role it was intended for (running and a defensive stance) while not being abused by sway. Other than that sway is easy to beat, your midline should be wanding the trappers so the pressure should be minimal. If you're still having trouble, most balanced teams run a para anyway, just stick bladeturn refrain on him, it stops sway cold and is greater against dervish and axe/sword warrior spikes.--Goldenstar 17:32, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Escape should end if you attack, rending touch needs longer recharge, that should be how to nerf it.Watch me work it 04:19, 2 April 2008 (EDT)

I don't think this will be nerfed, the trappers can be stopped with wands, the pressure from the R/Ds isn't really that much, and with traps so easy to shut down spirits are easy targets. Knowing Izzy in the past, something (Probably Escape) will be nerfed, but expertise and the scythe attacks will likely stay the same. This build is just used a lot because it's simple to pug and somewhat effective. Phalmatticus 18:43, 9 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Izzy isn't going to nerf the thing that really needs a nerf, scythes. --71.229 18:46, 9 April 2008 (EDT)
 * You're probably right [[Image:RailinWoHInvertedSig.jpg|19px]]Phalmatticus 20:53, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

riiight...
can i just say /fail /gay? i mean wtf this build. almost as sad as iway, may be fun but i prefer balanced more :) Mr-HaXx
 * This isnt fun in the slightest. Its just lameass farmway. Rawrawr  13:46, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * If you want fun, run randomway. Then cry from laughter when you beat Sway. [[Image:mightymouse.gif|25px]] moush$2+2=4$ 17:22, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Randomway is love. --71.229 17:25, 1 April 2008 (EDT)
 * What is randomway? I see people talk about it and forming groups for it but i never saw what the build is . Someone should put it on the wiki --Droks 07:37, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * It's random. A random team, usually a PUG who don't know how to HA or GW.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 07:42, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * What a terrible idea i see this "lfg randomway" you could at least form a balanced group even PvE can manage that and its not like the gimmicks like sway at hard to pot together --Droks 07:46, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Randomway is good for lolz, especially when you beat people.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 07:47, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Poison
-Have one of the R/D's run with apply poison for extra pressure? Muryman 13:38, 3 April 2008 (EDT)

Victorious Sweep?
I've seen quite a few teams have success using Victorious Sweep over Eremite's Attack, the extra damage is a nice addition to the team's pressure Phalmatticus 17:32, 6 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Eremites is more extra damage since it's faster cast, so your next swing is earlier. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  07:18, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Meta
This is the new meta no doubdt. But its not just a bad thing, there are more people doing HA than ever and maybe people get better and learn how to play and keep playing HA. Then maybe u don't have to wait for one hour before u find a team.--Luwigo 13:53, 13 April 2008 (EDT)
 * You still have to, I know. God  box   15:37, 18 April 2008 (EDT)

why the hate?
Pardon me for asking, but why do people hate this? I mean, if it is good, and it works, and it takes very little skill to use, doesnt that mean that whoever came up with it was very smart? How can you be mad at people for using what works best? Im not understanding. (Kiron 11:18, 22 April 2008 (EDT))
 * No one is. It's just that the most people who are more experienced don't like the fact that such a build as this consisting of unranked idiots can easily roll over their skill based builds. God  box   05:31, 23 April 2008 (EDT)
 * The reason people hate this is that it's a farming build being used on other players. When you run Sway you fully expect to lose after one or two matches. So you go in, button bash like an angry monkey and then get beaten by decent players running a balanced build. And you're 1 or 2 Fame better for it. And all you ever learn is how to button bash and lose to decent players. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]]  sexiness!  05:50, 23 April 2008 (EDT)
 * The point is, that the old sway(this one doesn't) also rolled those decent teams. When they had 0 skill and button mash. And yeah; people get mad for that. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  07:16, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Nerf
What skill would ANet nerf if this became overpowered? If they nerf escape, runners everywhere are gonna b uberpissed.  * Jebus  *   Is    I  23:05, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Escape ends when you attack, Expertise only effects bow attacks.  文 Display  [[Image:Blackout.jpg|19px]]  wtb mes tomes  09:34, 8 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Yea, that's the question floating around my mind, what will they nerf, if anything. Except for Rending Touch, I don't see any of these skills as vastly overpowered. Escape isn't an unremovable para shout or rit weapon spell, it's a primary attrib-bound elite, and cannot be maintained constantly. Maybe stance removal skills will get more into the meta because of this? Rending Touch and Pious Assault should be changed to: "Removes an enchantment. Removal effect: ...", akin to Winds of Disenchantment and Irresistible Sweep, respectively. Endrosz 09:18, 19 May 2008 (EDT)

Name
CHANGE THE FUCKIN NAME!!!! I KEEP THINKING THAT ITS "SWAY", THEN I REALIZE THAT ITS REALLY S-WAY. FUKKIN CHANGE IT!  * Jebus  *   Is    I  23:05, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Sorry, shift key was broken. [[image:IAmJebus_sig2.jpg|19px]] * Jebus  *   Is    I  23:06, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * That's when you use Caps Lock.  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 23:08, 7 May 2008 (EDT)
 * It's called Sway ffs. God  box   10:03, 8 May 2008 (EDT)

counter
Governor Lukas Alexander:Try to gather/make counters, if there are no counters, HA becomes as shitty as Hero Battles! Techpriest Enginseer: I'm on it.

it's a truth that I'm on it! Fear the power of the Emperor--Borotvalt 14:17, 18 May 2008 (EDT)
 * IG own. --71.229 14:21, 18 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Skills have been prepared. just a little fixing and adding the attributes and the Counter-Sway/CSway (it will use mostly Counter techniques) will be ready (to post on pvxwiki after a test).--Borotvalt 04:04, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Counter builds fail.  09:19, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * (EC)Unless counter-sway is counter balanced, counter massacreway, counter legoway, and counter eurospike, too, then I wouldn't bother tbh. - PANIC!  [[Image:Panic_sig4.png|50px|18px]]  sexiness!  09:22, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Yep, thats what I said... But in less words.  09:23, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * User:borotvalt/csway usage is not listed!--Borotvalt 14:11, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Sorry, but that's pretty terrible. You conter sway by wanding trappers, not balling and raping the N/Rts. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]<font color="Black">Tab  <font color="Black">Moo  14:20, 19 May 2008 (EDT)
 * look at it again. got some changes.Borotvalt 10:45, 23 May 2008 (EDT)

Skill Update
How good is this now that a few of the skills have been brutally spanked by the Nerfbat. Doesn't seem too big of a change, but I dunno.

^ was me Nature 18:31, 22 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Nah, people will still run it. It was still run last time the nerfs were in effect. It's only really a 1/4 second extra on Eremite's and Mystic, they are still pretty damn good. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  18:33, 22 May 2008 (EDT)

Sway is gay, it rhymes, everyone knows it, i'm just the only one saying it


 * Yeah, I think Sway is used way too much for it to go out of use simply over small nerfs of a couple of skills. --Vorith 23:50, 22 May 2008 (EDT)
 * It's again only temporary anyway. Drag  nmn   talk cont  12:01, 23 May 2008 (EDT)
 * The update? Not really. ~ <font color="#444">ĐONT <font color="#444">* <font color="#444">TALK  12:10, 23 May 2008 (EDT)
 * It's not temporary, but it's not a big effect. An extra quarter second on one attack skill? It's still way faster activation than a normal scythe attack. No one changed anything during the temporary update, I'm sure people will keep bashing away with Sway after this. Needs moar nerf. Ouch, I wonder if they will simply disable soul reaping in PvP next. - [[image:miserysig1.jpg]] isery   -TALK  12:51, 23 May 2008 (EDT)

FUN!
LOL Xx Gerard xX 20:33, 31 May 2008 (EDT)
 * its a trap... save the kidz 95.119.40.67 13:41, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

What screws this pile of shit over sideways
The way to screw this over. Most teams will be running a mesmer, unless they're bad enough to not be running balanced with a mes. One sig of humil on the smoke trapper. Interrupt the SoC. Keep midliners fixed on trappers. There's a massive amount of pressure gone already, since with this a lot of the time people drop due to the sheer power of the smoke trapper. A lot of people underestimate the power of that one player running that. You're whole backline's dazed with one R/D on each, going nuts under LR. Oshit, there goes my backline. EXteel 08:14, 2 June 2008 (EDT) another thing you can do with the mes is to shutdown the expel, especially if you have a migraine mes it is easy to do because there is nobody else on the team that has the power to remove hexes to save the expel, then just interrupt everything he does with the help of migraine
 * Well in teams that use a signet smiter mesmer, you don't need to shut down the expel. Dual migrainers should shut down the expel though. EXteel 20:11, 4 June 2008 (EDT)
 * How to rape sway, have a hawt frontline and actually being able to kill shit; before they kill you. Fuck defense, no matter how much passives your monks won't last forever anyway. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  18:15, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

Counters section
Should we add one for those teams noob enough to not know how the hell you're supposed to beat sway? EXteel 08:15, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Nah. It's quite easy to counter this and they should be able to figure it out themselves. Also, making counter-builds is a bad idea; and that's what that will most likely lead to. God  box   08:19, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Not counter builds, but a general counter character, since one character screws this over sideways. Read above section to see if I'm right, most decent balanced teams should run a mesmer with a reliable interrupt, since you can't rely on physicals to get a knockdown on ghostly against a team running blockwebs or mass blinds. EXteel 08:22, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * I beat sway relatively consistently with Randomway. Rape the N/Rts, midline wands trappers. I happened to be running a Magebane or BA Ranger in randomway(wanted to practice interrupts), so yeah, the trappers did get pretty screwed over. As long as you keep the number of traps low and the N/Rts pressured most sways collapse, partially because most sways are bad anyway. - 08:33, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Sway with good players owns, rust me, also, WoW on Trappers, there goes your D-Shot. --  Super Igor  [[Image:Igor_Ninjask.png|19px]] *ninja!!*  09:05, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * If the N/Rts can afford to spend time WoWing the trappers you aren't pressuring them enough. Yes, R10 sway is irritating and won't be beaten by unranked randomway but farm faming to rank 10 with sway is lame beyond lame. - 09:08, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Rank 10 Sway may be good, but so is every r10 team. Being good isn't reserved for Sway only, and in most cases r10 teams will get more kills with better team builds. God  box   09:38, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * There is no good Shitway, rank doesn't mean anything.  ≈ Display  [[image:Horrified.png|19px]]  lolcat  03:02, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Actually, there is no difference between r10 sway and r3 sway, except for noobie mistakes like balling up against sh(lolol, this is pretty much the easiest tactic to roll them). R/D's just camp a monk and spam shit at him, r10 or r0 it doesn't matter, you bash buttons on your bar. N/rt's can redbar in ha anyway, and people are just too dumb to actually use WoW as a guardian; they just pre-use it at n/rt's 24/7, not at the actual pressured targets. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  18:14, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

Update
i play sway since 2 months and the actual build is a bit out-of-use...

1. Eremite's Attack is kind of nerfed... other options would be Victorious Sweep oder Radiant Scythe.

2. R/E drop Flame Trap and add Ward against Foes! You cant snare only with Grasping Earth... -.-

3. R/P should have Lightning Reflexes and a Furious-Spear to gain adrenalin faster.

4. Flame Trap can be changed to "Make Haste" for relic runs.

5. Destruction change to Bloodsong! The N/Rt need the spirits and Bloodsong lasts longer!

6. Death Pact change to Flesh of my Flesh! No Sway plays with Death Pact... (wtf)

7. The best [!](i only played n/rt and its an experienced advice) elites are Preservation (+Recup & Li Ming) and Offering of Spirit (+Recu & Life) - against good teams you need Preservation as a "spam-spirit" and "oos" for energy if enemies dont die or on altar maps.

you should change the build like this, so lower ranked sway players can play like the pros ;) &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 131.246.178.155 (contribs).


 * It's Sway, no one who is playing it is playing like a pro. It's actually starting to fall out of use entirely. I love encountering Sway, it's the easiest team to beat, but now all I see are a billion different variations of Rspike, which due to their assload of defence is a lot harder to kill and takes longer. That aside, many of your points are stupid. Bloodsong may last longer, but you have 3524624 spirits anyway, so one lasting longer doesn't really help. Death Pact Signet is good if you know when to use it, but I suppose unfortunately Sway players don't so yes, FomF is probably better, but a lot of teams take a copy of FomF on one of the N/Rts. Most of your pressure comes from traps, removing them isn't smart. Sway isn't designed to hold halls, it's a fame farm so making room for Make Haste for relics is silly. All in all, it's Sway, no one gives a crap. And lol again for suggesting that pros play Sway. - 03:12, 18 June 2008 (EDT)


 * Lol, I have seen r9 swayers. :P
 * R9 Sway != pro sway, it equals a lot of sway. - 07:28, 30 June 2008 (EDT)
 * R9 SWAY = R0 SWAY = R15 SWAY tbh. Brandnew.  07:34, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

Oni cried of laughter when he read you should change the build like this, so lower ranked sway players can play like the pros ;) Running Sway is the same as running ursan. you only do it because you are a fag. And fags will never be pros. -Oni- 22:25, 16 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Ursan is underpowered, so what's your point?  ɟoʇuɐʌ ʎʞɔıɹ [[Image:Panic_srsbsns.gif|37px]] 22:26, 16 July 2008 (EDT)

Nerf
needs a skill swapped in instead of the nerfed chilling victory,
 * You could lower expertise a bit, making chilling cost 5 energy in stead of 4 and put the rest in wind tbh. -- Sazzy  19:20, 19 July 2008 (EDT)

Meta
Haven't seen it in a while, but haven't really HAed in a while. Still in / kinda in / everyone went back to heroway? --71.229 18:46, 3 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Yeh, been seeing a lot of heroways with two thumpers + an SA sin lately--<font color=#C68E17>Golden [[image:Goldenstar.JPG|19px]]<font color=#C68E17>Star 18:57, 3 August 2008 (EDT)
 * I wonder how this would compare against rspike?--[[Image:Relyk Ike.jpg|17px]] R <font color="green" size="1"> e l y k 00:56, 23 August 2008 (EDT)
 * Shitty? Can't stop the spike and 3 monk backline is usually plenty o stand up to the thumpers till you can DP them out.--<font color=#C68E17>Golden [[image:Goldenstar.JPG|19px]]<font color=#C68E17>Star 01:01, 23 August 2008 (EDT)

I had to lul


<font color="#AA226D" face="times new roman" size="2"> ツ cedave  (contributions☆buildpage)  11:55, 13 September 2008 (EDT)

So
A little birdy told me this was in HA again.  Life  02:16, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
 * It sucks balls m8.--Goldenstar 02:16, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Well then im going to rip off danny's balls.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 02:17, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
 * it wins --DarkChaosSig.png 20:14, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Not R/D sway, go to id1 sometime, only sway is r/a--TahiriVeila 20:16, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

R/A Sway is only approximately 99% of HA at the moment. It's definitely not a problem I guarantee you. <font color="#FDD017" face="blackadder itc">uɐɟ <font color="#FDD017" face="blackadder itc">ɐʞıd  <font color="#FF0033">o <font color="#000000">^_^ <font color="#FF0033">o  <font color="#996600">¸ <font color="#FFCC00">« <font color="#FFCC00">` 20:27, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Meta Update
Biiiiig update for the sway team composition.
 * Is this not staying as it was for historical value or something, especially given there are two other pages with the R/A version on (R/A sway and general Sway)? 86.10.10.140 16:42, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

The description on the build was wrong >.>
The description for the R/A builds was wrong. it was saying something about a scythe so i fixed it. didnt know the templates so i just erased them. yw... ChuckieReturns2 00:48, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * don't edit archived builds please. Drahgal Meir 00:54, September 7, 2009 (UTC)