Archive talk:Team - GvG Dom Balanced

True DF Honor. &mdash;  Skakid  21:20, 1 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Standardness ftw--Goldenstar 21:30, 1 June 2008 (EDT)


 * Why balanced when you can name it DF honor or eurospike.  Fishels [슴Mc슴] Mootles  12:24, 2 June 2008 (EDT)


 * You can easily play this without spiking. &mdash;  Skakid  15:27, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
 * This is still prty much eurospike.  Fishels [슴Mc슴] Mootles  14:22, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Only if you play it like eurospike. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]Tab  Moo  14:23, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Shard storm + F-gust + Shackles? I think you'd better take shackles + fgust, with something like... rend? —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  10:08, 5 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Yea, just a waste of space, could atleast use rend or leave as utility...--[[Image:Relyk Purifying Veil Sig.jpg|19px]]R ELYK   ʞlɐʇ ʎɯ  02:59, 7 June 2008 (EDT)
 * Are two guardians needed, or just there for the tons of melee out there?--[[Image:Relyk Purifying Veil Sig.jpg|19px]]R ELYK   ʞlɐʇ ʎɯ  22:19, 12 June 2008 (EDT)
 * 2 guardians are needed in the current meta... —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  04:46, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

Current Balanced
Runs a fast caster snarer, change mebe?  Frosty  No U!  14:47, 15 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Nope. This is the general balanced build, not a fotm counter for the general balanced build. --[[Image:Ibreaktoilets_Signature.jpg|User:Ibreaktoilets|20px]]Tab  Moo  14:48, 15 July 2008 (EDT)

mebbe swap current mesmer build for ineptitude? seen a lot of the top guilds running it instead of your current one
 * Ineptitude mesmers are for shitters who suck at using guardian--Golden [[image:Goldenstar.JPG|19px]]Star 20:10, 11 August 2008 (EDT)

Missing elementalist
The Elementalist build and build code is missing in the lower part of the build. -- Deat hwe arer  15:21, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Someone changed it to 'Change to Fc Snare' so i have for the fact a build there is better than text saying change, not sure if fc snare is balanced though.Funking Hostile 15:58, 29 July 2008 (EDT)

Waste not Want <> P-Drain
Seen most ppl run Waste since they dont need to swap targets etc, not sure thou whats best - Pdrain = 16enj 20sec and u must interrupt while Waste is about 9enj each 15sec whit just hitting a warrior who is snared.. Massive  06:11, 14 September 2008 (EDT)
 * Hitting pdrain is hard, makes you camp monks and position bad. It's just not beneficial as me/e. Take want not waste not. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  06:04, 26 September 2008 (EDT)
 * Imo the hottest combination is that ether phantom drain delusions beauty. not the best emanagement but an amazinggg offesne effect. --Dark0805 ( Rant /Contributions ) 18:42, 28 September 2008 (EDT)
 * It really comes down to preference. Drain and Ether Phantom/Drain Delusions are quite easy, P-Drain and WNWNT are a little harder. --[[Image:GoD_Hammer_and_Sickle.jpg|19px]]  Guild  of   Deals   18:43, 28 September 2008 (EDT)

Willing to buy a screen shot of somebody actually running power drain on the fast cast mesmer bar. I've honestly never seen it, but apparently somebody thinks that's the standard. Pluto 19:37, 6 October 2008 (EDT) edit: pref. somebody that actually counts too, not just a screenshot of yourself running it.
 * You just need to know that it is an energy management skill that can't be interrupted or stripped. Which is pretty strong in my - no wait - everyone's opinion Jonas 20:40, 29 October 2008 (EDT)

monks attributes
hex breaker says 25 and 30 secounds with only 2 and 3 dom magic. Unless there has a been a recent change in the last week your duration is messed up. 3 dom is needed to keep hex breaker at 15. other than that this build is fine. If i were running id drop recup for life, but preference is preference.
 * Check AN, its a known bug -- Frosty [[Image:Mini england.jpg|19px]] 20:36, 29 October 2008 (EDT)

Aegis or Hex Breaker
Leaving it optionall... Massive  17:16, 22 November 2008 (EST)

Soory on the build swapping tought i was on another side :> Massive   18:08, 12 December 2008 (EST)
 * It's been like 1 day. Give it a while. On the first day of the other big buff people were running WE Scythes. -- 18:17, 12 December 2008 (EST)
 * Methinks Hex Breaker, since the current meta IS Hexgay. --Ulterion 22:51, 26 December 2008 (EST)

typo
in the flagger's build's name was written "caretaker's charge", but at the top of the page and the elite was actually "hidden caltrops", i fixed that :D
 * if you were an anon I'd have told you that you are a strong anon. But you're not an anon. Brandnew.  22:53, 26 December 2008 (EST)

WTF?
Yeah my ass Lingering Curse comes under:

A GvG team capable of adapting to many situations and outplaying gimmicky opponents through player skill and good tactics.

(player skill) haha any noob can run lingering curse and win.

121.220.200.104 05:48, 28 December 2008 (EST)
 * Bitchrole [[Image:Frostrage.jpg|19px]]Frosty <font color="Blue"> po!  06:30, 28 December 2008 (EST)
 * Somebody doesn't grasp the concept of positioning.<font color="#FDD017" face="blackadder itc">Pika <font color="#FDD017" face="blackadder itc">Fan  22:06, 27 December 2008 (EST) 06:58, 28 December 2008 (EST)

Ling curs-way actually sorta isn't that balanced, it's just blowup degen(according that your ranger spams hunter's+savage well). —ǘŋ Ɛxɩsƫ  07:48, 31 December 2008 (EST)
 * The definition of balanced would be an adaptable build that can perform well in pretty much any situation, changing the water mes to a necro doesn't change that, it just gives you more pressure at the cost of some defense. [[Image:Cute McMonkey.png]]Tab 07:49, 31 December 2008 (EST)
 * Ling curs preforms only well in 8v8 ;/ —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  06:24, 1 January 2009 (EST)
 * Then why is it so popular in TA?--159.230.137.166 17:59, 16 January 2009 (EST)
 * That's cause people in TA are too lazy to take a real elite(WoD). Look in the hands of a amazing necro and say again then. WoD simply is too powerful, but it's really hard to use. —ǘŋ  Ɛxɩsƫ  15:10, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Balanced
OMGZ THE BALANCETHIS TEAM IS SO BALANCED AHH I HAVENOTHING TO AHH AT WTF MY SPACEKEY ISANNOYING AHHHH!!! BALANCESZZZZZZZ 71.243.22.41 13:20, 3 January 2009 (EST)

Try Rohypnol

Support Rit
...instead of Dom Mesmer? Was very popular in the last mAT... --Melvelet 07:51, 4 February 2009 (EST)
 * Thats Rawrspike [[Image:Frostrage.jpg|19px]]<font color="Blue">Frosty <font color="Blue"> po!  08:18, 4 February 2009 (EST)
 * Oh, I'd better be quiet now...^^--Melvelet 10:10, 4 February 2009 (EST)

update to reflect the LoDsmite/SF meta or make a new page? nvm I'm a retarded GvG'r -- -Ch ao s-   11:48, 12 February 2009 (EST)

HC Flagger Nerfed
Update/Archive? Toraen 05:39, 6 March 2009 (UTC)
 * You can't archive balanced. Just rewrite the build [[Image:JonasGWWAvatar.jpg]]  Jonas  03:06, 10 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Why don't you put the dps on bsurge and flesh on the war? ele has already specced into resto. --Mel Ve Let 16:31, 1 April 2009 (UTC)

Bsurge
FC LoD is seeing more play than bsurge lately, sometimes a kappa spiker instead.--Goldenstar 21:02, 7 April 2009 (UTC)
 * ... Rawrawr Dinosaur 15:10, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Updated
for current balanced. <font color="Blue">Frosty <font color="Blue"> the <font color="Blue">Admin 10:15, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ^ Again on the 27th--Goldenstar 04:11, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Wait...people actually use Elite Rip Enchantment??-- Ikimono "My beard is thick." [[Image:Monk-Paragon-icon.png|24px]] 06:58, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Rip is almost better if bleeding doesn't get removed.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 07:13, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Corrupt is fucking amazing. -- <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Frosty  <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Mc Admin  09:32, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Corrupt is pretty amazing. -- Crowels [슴Mc슴] Mootles  10:11, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Also Life, the fact that bleeding is a condition means it will probably just get RCed off for redbar. CE is amazing because it can either cover an important hex, be the only hex on somebody and be a wasted remove, or deal a fair bit of degen (and with poison it will be maxed out) -- Crowels [슴Mc슴] Mootles  10:15, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * csg :> -- <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Frosty  <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Mc Admin  10:56, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Forgot to mention, against spikes teams it's sexy because you can rape the water ele even if he has AoR as a cover with Rip + CE. -- Crowels [슴Mc슴] Mootles  11:41, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

Water Ele Taken Out?
Can someone explain this change? The water from before could still aid spikes but help snare and hex up frontline. Is going pure damage going to help more?--<font color='red'>X <font color='black'>a <font color='red'>m <font color='black'>o <font color='red'>r <font color='black'>o 19:28, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

Crybuild?
This build isnt balanced any more,its Crybuild. Balanced should be able to win vs. anything but this build isnt(dual para).

Frostee
@Raping the runner attributes. Is there really nothing we can do to save the poor... guy? -- -Ch  ao  s-   17:26, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * That's standard E/Rt attributes for Freezing Gust, and Freezing Gust > all. Although I said in variants you can use a different runner. -- <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Frosty  <span style="font-family:mistral, cursive;">Mc Admin  17:47, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * Figured it'd be fine, but it looks so ugly. -- -Ch  ao  s-   18:14, September 19, 2009 (UTC)
 * Ups, I misread air for water and vice versa. Call it being bad if you wish. -- -Ch  ao  s-   19:31, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

Defy Pain
Seeing some defy pain axes over hammer warriors. Makes a nice split char and let's you perma frenzy at stand through a spike meta.--TahiriVeila 17:47, November 16, 2009 (UTC)

Draw?
What?  —ǥrɩɳsɧƴ ɖɩđđɭɘş   21:07, November 16, 2009 (UTC)
 * when your prot has deep wound covered by poison, you need draw. Gringo 22:15, November 16, 2009 (UTC)
 * b/c he's going to draw himself, c?--TahiriVeila 23:00, November 16, 2009 (UTC)
 * harhar. fixed. Gringo 00:09, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
 * So splits are even more dead?  —ǥrɩɳsɧƴ ɖɩđđɭɘş  [[Image:Grinshpon blinky cake.gif|19px]] 01:34, November 17, 2009 (UTC)
 * distortion, dwayna's touch, and immolate all got nerfed, and but splits are still fairly common. not all teams run draw, its just a better stand skill, which is what most teams run (dual ranger or dual paragon). Gringo 01:50, November 17, 2009 (UTC)

Patient Spirit nerf
I think it killed this build. I just watched #23 almsot get stomped by a triple Ele team, the #23 of which was using the typical 2 monk backline and a Mesmer with WoH. Mayhaps it's too early, but I'm so very glad the meta is finally shifting. 141.165.171.149 06:27, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * wat --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 10:31, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * I've seen this build, almost invariably, played by every Guild under 100 rank and it's gotten boring. Now with Patient Spirit's healing reduced, it's not the same skill it used to be and this entire team build's structure suffers for it. The example I mentioned had to compensate so much for it, that it was hardly recognizable. #23 had taken a hench into a ranked GvG match, if you need any other proof of it. I'd be glad if this finally died. 141.165.171.118 19:17, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * HELLO, MY GUILD GOT RANK 1 UNDER A MONTH AGO WITH BALANCED, YOUR POINT IS INVALID. --Crow 19:38, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * Mesmer with WoH, I'm pretty sure that you weren't obsing balanced. --Crow 19:44, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * ps got nerfed ? o.o --Lusciious 22:31, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

Updated 1/31/10
--TahiriVeila 20:59, January 31, 2010 (UTC)
 * Dual Axe and LoD? Definetly should mention at least having a Me/E instead of the LoD or a MoI Ele. --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 08:22, February 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * Are people still running MoI eles? <font color="Black" face="Comic Sans" size="3">Tyrael [[Image:Life Sheath.jpg|19px]] <font color="Red"> No way!  12:53, February 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * Not all the time, but still occassionally --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 12:56, February 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * Thats weird, isnt it like inferior to FC water mesmers now? <font color="Black" face="Comic Sans" size="3">Tyrael [[Image:Life Sheath.jpg|19px]] <font color="Red"> No way!  13:41, February 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * We still run MoI and I can't remember our last loss with it (other than people being retarded, but that's nothing to do with MoI!). --Crow 16:00, February 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think that some sort of other defensive midline instead of the LoD should at least be mentioned (FC Snare,Bsurge Water hybrid,MoI), as I've seen some guilds running Bsurge Snare and other builds and I've got to say it works quite well and not necceserly worse then LoD.Dino Dave 16:17, February 13, 2010 (UTC)

Update
Warriors definately need a large update, the first one anyway, maybe the second one too. what do you think of the axe build with Soldier's Stance? Dino Dave 12:02, February 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Soldier's stance didn't get change in pvp nobr. PR is fine still--TahiriVeila 12:09, February 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Evissss. --Brandnew 12:51, February 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Most likely, i'll keep an eye out for the next few days and update this once a new standard becomes apparent--TahiriVeila 03:56, March 1, 2010 (UTC)

Updated 3/3/10
Swapped bsurge for bloodspam necro, primal express changed for shock axe. Added equipment and usages, can't believe this page didn't have them--TahiriVeila 22:35, March 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * why does this team have a bloodspam? so it can not split a midliner ever? ···  Danny So Cute    09:53, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Well it doesn't really matter since no one is playing balanced atm anyway so no true balanced exists right now. The closest is trip melee. And Me/N or ranger split just fine =\ --TahiriVeila 15:08, March 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Me/N can't split for shit. It has no damage or self-sustainability unless you're calling Life Siphon self-sustainability. =p splitting a ranger works ofc, but if you want to split more than 1, you're pretty much shit out of luck. ···  Danny So Cute    15:19, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
 * If you're actually sending a Me/N on split (I'm not sure why you would unless you were desperate for a kill), you will be sending a warrior + ranger with it at least, and 90% of the time when you're doing a serious split with those 2 you will send a runner or in rarer cases maybe the prot; self-sustainability no longer beecomes an issue. Midliners in the past haven't really been focused on splitting, b surges weren't often pushed to bases offensively, nor were FC Me/Es, LC necros, or any others. The only exception is MB, although I can't remember it being the most common midliner in balanced (I might just be remembering stuff wrong though!). Possibly MoI too, which dealt a lot of damage, although even that was more often used to snare up people collapsing to base. So unless I have misunderstood your point, it doesn't matter if the Me/N has a lot of damage or self-sustainability in split situations, most midliners never have. --Crow 15:58, March 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, my main point is that your weren't going to be killing shit with it, really. However, I've always figured a MB or MoI ele to be run, either of which has at least Aura to push some red bar, and possibly DTouch. If you're running anything else, you probably aren't splitting at all. ···  Danny So Cute    16:05, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Crow pretty much got it. With the exception of mind blast, caster midliners have never really split unless it's endgame and you're lordrushing. I guess I was thinking in terms of a defensive split, the me/n falling back to support a flagger. But even that doesn't make a lot of sense now that I think about it xD--TahiriVeila 16:20, March 30, 2010 (UTC)

Rit Lord Runner
Anybody else think it would work for this? <font color="Red">Jax 15:59, March 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * It would but meta runner = Shackles --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 16:20, March 7, 2010 (UTC)

Jatt Kittenstomper O.o
really?--67.70.70.174 15:16, March 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Nope. -- <font color="Crimson">Briar [[Image:User Briar Sig1.jpg|19px]] <font color="Crimson">Flame Me  16:47, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Are you suggesting there's something wrong with jatt kittenstomper?--TahiriVeila 18:14, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Speaking of Jatt Kittenstomper, is Jatt a reference to the Terrorist organisation? or is it just a random word they plopped in the front of the Kittenstomper name? O.o??? -- <font color="Crimson">Briar [[Image:User Briar Sig1.jpg|19px]] <font color="Crimson">Flame Me  18:26, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Have you ever obsed a match, ever? Jatt is one of the most famous hammer warriors in gws history. He was the core hammer for rawr and helped carry them to 13 golds with his euro-spiking, protknocking tactics.--TahiriVeila 20:50, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Tbh if im going to spend a couple hours staring at a screen (not playing a game) then i would rather watch TV. Thats not to say ive never Obs'd before. But I don't do it often. And famous GW'ers don't really affect me. The only famous GW persona I give a shit about is Wyte Rabbit tbh. -- <font color="Crimson">Briar [[Image:User Briar Sig1.jpg|19px]] <font color="Crimson">Flame Me  22:02, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * who?--TahiriVeila 22:12, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ask Life. He can tell you I'm sure. -- <font color="Crimson">Briar [[Image:User Briar Sig1.jpg|19px]] <font color="Crimson">Flame Me  22:54, March 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Sounds familiar but I'm blanking on who it is. Life   Guardian  15:39, March 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Something tells me briar wasn't talking about me. Life   Guardian  16:30, March 30, 2010 (UTC)

recent changes
anyone c/d that the recent edits reflect the meta? ···  Danny So Cute    17:17, 20 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Dont really see anybody running balanced atm.. trip melee pressure is as balanced as ive been seeing tbh.. -- Steamy .. x
 * ^ No one runs DF honour in this meta, or even dom balance.--TahiriVeila 18:01, April 20, 2010 (UTC)

That's the closest to balanced I have seen in a while, I would write it up on the page, but not sure if it's worth it right now because it is likely that the update will nerf Seeping Wound (if it doesn't then lol). --<font color="Black">Frosty  17:50, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * SW isnt being nerfed unfortunately. -- Steamy .. x 18:10, May 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well, not on the next update anyway. -- Steamy .. x 18:10, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Did they say that, it would make sense for them not to mention it, because it is A-net. --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 18:11, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Nope they didnt mention it. -- Steamy .. x 18:13, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * It would make equal sense for them to just ignore it until sometime next year. ···  Danny So Cute    20:28, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Leave balanced alone or even archive it. There's no one playing DF honour or dom dalance--TahiriVeila 20:31, May 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * ?-- Amor  [[Image:Accelerated_Growth.jpg|19px]] 22:03, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Not balanced, not being played--TahiriVeila 22:24, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * It pretty much is balanced. --Crow 22:44, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * zzz i guess you could call it balanced. I generally tend to think of the two "balanced" builds as df honour and dom balanced but w/e. Also no one runs magehunters, rarely evisc or WoC =P
 * if by no-one you mean [sup] smurf then yes you're right. -- Amor  [[Image:Accelerated_Growth.jpg|19px]] 22:54, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * lol and after [Book] (rank 6) get beaten by [sup] they use the very same build the next round. Albeit with an extra SW sin over the MB ele. But that's the nature of balanced, you don't have a rigid set of builds, you change your mid/frontline depending on the situation, and this is the closest I've seen to being balanced recently. -- Amor  [[Image:Accelerated_Growth.jpg|19px]] 23:05, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * http://xkcd.com/185/ Gringo 23:27, May 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * By that logic armor, balanced would be better of as a guide than a build. -- Steamy .. x 17:13, May 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * When an update comes out to fix shit (if ever) then balanced (proper balanced) will probably see play. At the moment it's just, Seeping Wound, fast cast mesmer, defencedefencedefence. --<font color="Black">Frosty  [[Image:Frostcharge.jpg|19px]] 17:45, May 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * is fc prot back in the game? i'm surprised it didn't start seeing play as soon as interrupt bots got into the game. ···  Danny So Cute    03:01, 8 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Not back. -- Steamy .. x 11:04, May 8, 2010 (UTC)

Really need archiving until there is some kind of balanced that actually works in this meta.. =/ -- Steamy .. x 22:28, May 10, 2010 (UTC)

Ups frosty got around to updating this before me--TahiriVeila 23:31, May 14, 2010 (UTC)

Change build to reflect new meta
-- Amor  02:41, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * we wouldn't put this on the balanced page, 2 dom mesmer spike shittery is the opposite of balanced. Gringo 03:47, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Not to mention the fact that making any changes to GvG before the mAT (while meta still hasn't solidified) is a pretty bad idea. Honestly we should just split GvG balanced into Dom balanced and DF honour as they're the only real balanced builds that are ever run and they never really change --TahiriVeila 05:32, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * no one runs df honor why would we post it...Gringo 05:34, May 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * No one runs dom balanced either. When balanced builds see play both usually get about the same amount of playtime. Tbh you wouldn't even need a new page since Team - GvG Paragon Balance is basically DF honour. Just rename that one DF honour and rename this page dom balanced. GG! If this makes no sense i'm sorry. I just got in and it's quarter of two and i'm a little a drunk--TahiriVeila 05:43, May 24, 2010 (UTC)

shit
water ele + damage mesmer, will update later --Lemming 06:00, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Somebody put a rit flagger in there instead of the Mo/E. I'm bad at internet and don't know how. 88.159.234.111 09:26, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Not relevant. The build's obsolete. --Lemming 10:00, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I thought that balanced never got archived, just changed? Norwegian Thunder 05:02, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

I have seen a few teams still running bala, but if Lemming says it's obsolete then there isn't much argument. I've mainly seen w/e w/p r/mo me/rt e/rt. <font color="Black">Frostels 08:15, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Put an invoke ele on. --Lemming 19:46, 31 December 2010 (UTC) (P.S. Euros are dumb.)
 * That's what the duo ele spike page is for, isn't it?--TahiriVeila 23:50, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
 * People don't run water eles anymore. --Lemming 21:48, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
 * It's an hybrid build

--Sewa 09:10, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd rather that be listed as a variant to the normal invoke bars. --Lemming 19:49, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

so what

something like that, no idea what's run and no idea what that optional would be (l bolt? rend? defensive skill? chain lightning? etc) <font color="Black">Frostels 20:33, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Aura of Restoration? --Sewa 20:37, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
 * etc etc etc <font color="Black">Frostels 20:40, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

Frontline needs to be changed. Any mixture of axe/hammer, axe/axe, axe/sword, or sword/sword works. If running 2 sword you probably want a blood necro instead of a water ele.--TahiriVeila 05:44, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Archive?
Unless there is another dom balance somewhere then this shouldn't be archived imo since it's always a viable balanced build. Nerfs to frontliners mean the frontline needs to be adjusted since it isn't a core part of the build. <font color="Black">Frostels 19:28, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * It hasn't been adjusted since it required a build update since May 2011!  Shadow  Talk  19:32, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Wow, ok since it's been so long. This place really is dead. <font color="Black">Frostels 19:41, 2 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Except for some idiots that show up sometime and think they are awesome and coowl and create great builds, but ultimately they suck and fail and whine and go crazy and spam and well, get blocked for 3 months or more, and then the vicious cycle reruns and this is how we go from and important site to a desert where there is nothing to see but silly sand...  Shadow  Talk  19:53, 2 February 2012 (UTC)