User talk:Jaigoda/Builds/Team - Bulldozerway

Theorycrafting is frigging awesome. I know getting this together is a stretch, but is it worth trying? --Jaigoda 20:27, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * All these buffs would be so much better if used with ms/db sins. Locusts just sucks--Goldenstar 20:55, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm too lazy to do the maths, but I know Critlocust does attack a good bit faster meaning damage buffs get multiplied faster, plus the adren gain and extra free slots that you get is just too sexy. I'd wager that with this amount of buffs a Crit Locust will do very similar damage to MBlossom (plus most MS builds nowadays use lead-offhand to get into it, which slows its initial DPS). Plus this has the advantage of extra free slots for utility, survivability, and domoges (Dodge This would never work well on an MBlossom bar). --Jaigoda 21:27, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Can someone tell me what the average damage for daggers @14 DM? Without including crits or anything, just base damage. If so, I can give a rough estimate on the DPS of both builds with the current buffs. --Jaigoda 22:37, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Alright, I just inserted in 15 damage per dagger attack, and pumped out some maths. With everything here, a Crit Locust should get around 154 DPS; MBlossom, counting only MS/DB spam, has around 200 DPS. Now here, most would stop and say, "+50 domoges than Locust build, auto lose," but here's the thing... Basically you should be able to do around 120 damage per attack with a regular autoattack. This means in 4 or 5 autoattacks the foe will die. Add in any +damage and that'll go down to 3-4 attacks. This means that an MBlossom using GFoxS/GFangS will likely kill the foe before even getting to Moebius. Don't even think about mentioning multiple people on a single foe. In other words, you're only going to use your elite a fraction of the time, which is baed in terms of efficiency. As much as I love MBlossom, it's not going to work here. --Jaigoda 23:13, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * aoe from death blossom ownz--Relyk 23:26, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * AoE from Death Blossom never happens if the target dies in the first one or two attacks (two targets on one). Also, Mark of Pain.. --Jaigoda 23:42, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Take out darkfury, and take a closer look at OotV 76.188.100.220 01:04, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Lacks GDW as well.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 01:05, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Huh. Could have sworn it was OoP that had the 'no Necro enchantments' clause. Fixed anyway. Added GDW on the 'Sins, so they each have tocast it on a different 'Sin. Any other comments? I don't know, this looks really sexy. --Jaigoda 01:58, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Probably needs 2 SY! spammers or the one is going to be anally raped.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 01:59, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * He has Crit Defenses with 20+AL from Agility, and Vig Spirit is like autotank when you're hitting almost 1.5 times a second. All it means is they're gonna waste damage on him, rather than the casters. --Jaigoda 02:21, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * You know... All CA is doing right now is the 33% speed boost.. Would it be at all reasonable to change it to another IAS and take another PvE skill? Probably not practical, but... --Jaigoda 18:45, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Last comment failed overall. I re-edited the build to separate the blood and curses. Now everything has literally limitless energy. Seriously, stick a 25e skill on any of the bars (cept maybe the monk), and it won't make a fucking difference. Any more suggestions? I still want to try and test this out before I actually try and get it vetted, but without a guild it'll be difficult. --Jaigoda 16:56, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Take Whirlwind Attack on the worker. Charges SY in a second and iirc you can get double-strikes on each attack. ··· Danny   Does   Drugs  18:01, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * You can't get double strikes on attack skills. Still, not a bad idea; I'll add it to the optional. --Jaigoda 21:53, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * gz, your build just got buffed into gw heaven. FMK- 23:31, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Leaked info was right. That update was a random, steaming pile of shit right thar. Still, SoH is exxxxxtra gud nao. So, is it cool to move this into testing now? Honestly, with all the 'Sins running around everywhere, this wouldn't be hard to make as the next B/P-type build. --Jaigoda 01:28, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Also, found this over on Guru: DPS much? And that's without the necro buffs added in, which adds in an easy +20 per hit. And I have no idea whether this is pre-SoHwtfpwnage or not. --Jaigoda 03:21, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Alright, changed it a bit more and I honestly think this is about as good as it gets. Obviously it's theorycraft, but so is This and it's in Great. Plus, 'Sins, Necros, Mesmers and Monks are honestly not too hard to come by at the moment, so it shouldn't be incredibly difficult to set it up. Anyone got advice? --Jaigoda 15:59, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

Moebius
says hi. It would like you to know that it, too, can deal assloads of damage with DB and can produce just as many double-strikes via dual attack spam. Due to recent events, it's currently pounding the shit out of SoH in the back of a Benz, so I'm sure you can see why it would be a rather great idea to take it over a gimped skill like LF. 128.255.218.50 16:10, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Christ, did you not read what I said earlier? With this many buffs, you won't even get to Moebius. The best you can do is like lead>offhand>DB before the target dies. Plus, this gains a lot more adrenaline than MBlossom, even counting in dual attacks, meaning SY and DT can both be used faster and with less downtime. MS>DB is awesome, but LF still has its niche. --Jaigoda 04:10, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Bumpzzz --Jaigoda 21:54, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Testing
If I move it there, will it get WELL'd? 'Cause I tested it a bit: In IotN using only heroes with SoH and OoP/DF (all of which were only 12-13 in the attribute), this build was hitting for more than an average of 150 DPS. That's without Barbs, MoP, EBSoH, GDW, and actually good ranks in Asuran Scan and "DT!" (I think I have like 2 in each title). This should be able to get around 250 DPS apeice (or around 850-900 total). Also, I ran it with just me and my Sabway (with Barbs, MoP, and Splinter), and it worked great. Plus, I'm going to try to get my guild to run this thing and see if it works. --Jaigoda 01:14, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
 * just from a theorycrafting standpoint this looks like a wet dream tbh.FMK- 06:30, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Here's my standpoint on that: If B/P worked and even still works, this should be able to work. This is honestly easier than B/P, has more well-used professions (rangers are hard to come by now), and is quite superior in terms of damage output and defense. Why is this so much more of a theorycraft than B/P once was? -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 15:02, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I got tired of this not seeing daylight while sitting on my userpage, so I'm going ahead with testing. From the tests I've made, I think this actually should work. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 16:15, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Calculations
I'm redoing my math with the new stuff (SoH buff, split Necros, etc.) and I'm coming out with around 195 damage (with 6 in each title and with the attributes given in the build) for each autoattack when all buffs are up. Likely at one time all but one or two buffs should be up, so it'll probably average around, say, 170 per hit. In other words, a Crit Locust should be able to kill most anything in about 1.8 seconds (2 attacks, assuming at least one double strikes). And this pretty much blows the MS>DB argument out of the water, because everything would pretty much be guaranteed to die before MS ever hits, and if two 'Sins attacked the same target, you can forget DB. Oh, and I'm gonna play around with a few more ideas.... -- Jai Goes Monksassin  19:07, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Should run 3 WE axe for cyclone. [[Image:Zyke-Sig.png]] 02:30, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Will add as an option, as well as a variant for others (Whirlwind Attack...). That means there should be at least one build per melee prof, which is good for flexibility. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 03:01, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Any possibility of this being featured? -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 15:22, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Bumpzzz. And WTF, how would a guide be better than this? If you want to do it that way, then all team farming builds should be converted to guides. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 18:17, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
 * write up some suggested areas and that should be enough imo to get rid of the well tagFMK- 01:20, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll need some help there, because I don't get to play enough to know where this would work (which is why I theorycraft :/). And could more people actually comment on the build? It's getting tiring talking to myself. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 11:44, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Honestly? you dont need to work too hard on where this works. Anywhere without overload of anti-melee/blocking spamming is fine. I just did some general runs, and the only place it was semi limited in was HM charr in like grothmar wardowns (I think thats the area) --Kurai Katar

Reason: write a fucking guide.
Its for fucking normal pve. Whats a c-space? Andy 23:49, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Test!
Omg this looks so awsome move it to testing FFS, I will vote 5-5-5! --Chaos350 08:35, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Not sure if you're serious or not... If you are, then no, because it really doesn't have much purpose other than just maybe being a fun build to play around with, and will just get WELL'd again. If you're not serious... fuck off. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 14:08, 21 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually I was serious. Havn't tried it out but it looks pretty good and btw, this builds purpose may be VQ or sumthing, just like discord or sab or some other shit.--Chaos350 21:41, 22 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Sab and Discord are popular because they take only 1-2 people to use them with good results. This requires an entire team of players. That's a pretty big difference there. I mean, I would love to see this actually be put to use, but realistically I doubt it can happen. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 01:00, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Have you considered using this as a Deep Farm? I tried this exact setup with a 1hp Bip and a few Smiter monks with Balthazar's Aura for the Hell of it, and omg Kanaxai died in ten seconds no fucking joke. This has potential as a Vanquish type thing too if you get one other person and set up heroes. I love your work. Thank you for making this, and god make a guide and put it into testing once the theorycraft is done. I'd personally put in a prot monk using essence bond on one of the tanks, Zealous Benediction, Protective Spirit, and the rest your choice, and an HB monk, simply because HB in many cases rocks. I brought Restore condition to COF and the Deep though. I hate conditions. 04:33, September 2, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk