Build talk:R/W Barrage

RT/R
16 channelling gets 5 arrows to proc splinter and 53 dmg from each, and just bash a great dwarf armor for armor compensation:P

Sup Rune is fail80.56.148.251 07:00, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Suggestions
I'd like to bring light on some things the creator of this page wrote. Since when are spells affected by Expertise? In the Ranger/Monk subsection, it is said Expertise reduces energy cost of Healing Touch (which is a spell!), Renew Life and another hard rez, those being spells too... -- Fexghadi
 * I believe it is referring to the fact that Expertise effects all Touch skill from any profession. Healing Touch, along with the two resurrection skills you mentioned are all Touch range skills.  [[Image:DE Sig Test 2.jpg|50x19px]]  *Defiant Elements*   +talk  10:26, 28 June 2007 (EDT)
 * Thus even if they make R/N touch skills become spells, won't change a thing, except if you manage to power block them... ANet has some gay ideas :/ -- Fexghadi
 * "Save Yourselves!" on this build is win. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 06:35, 12 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Build still doesn't seem organized enough. Should add in the Monk and Elementalist variants. Mending Touch and Conjure Flame Barrager should be made along with the Ritualist.--Relyk 17:02, 5 January 2008 (EST)

This build shouldn't be in the great category
According to the voting policy builds cannot be put into a category until they have 5+ votes. i'm moving it back to where it was before. (right now it is in great. it should be uncategorized).
 * this builds shit actually, barrage alone.. gg useless, no mark of pain or splinter or brutal?
 * Actually reading the page FTW? That's where the variants section is for. This page is like a general Barrage build page with all it's possibilities. 80.56.148.251 07:03, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Not General Enough
I think there should be more optional spaces on the main bar, especially since there's a shitload of variants, and the build is suppose to be general, not specific. Antidote signet and whirling should be dumped, since they're both utility and is dependent on the situation. --8765 08:09, 13 July 2007 (CEST)


 * which is probably a good idea. I'm up for it. Bluemilkman 23:19, 16 July 2007 (CEST)


 * True and I started this build as such, but at the time, optional slots were frowned upon and usually meant the death of any build that was submitted (back on Guildwiki). It was always suggested to have all skills listed that were required for the build to function and placing just barrage on there didn't work.  Essentially, filling the whole skill bar and suggesting switchouts received a much better response.  Keep in mind this was assembled a looong time ago by me and peoples preferences can change.  If more people want optional slots, so be it.  As long as you keep the idea of the build together I'll support any changes. --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  03:34, 17 July 2007 (CEST)


 * Or, have people actually read the Variants section. There's an idea. =P &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:14, 6 September 2007 (CEST)

Farming?
I really lack to see how this build could farm. maybe its just me but it wouldnt be a farming build in my eyes.Lithen 21:55, 14 July 2007 (CEST)
 * The R/Mo build has been used for farming many an area for one and other R/E builds as well that incorporate Earth skills. It's always been very specific enemies and areas but it has often been used for farming.  I think you are focusing too much on the primary build choice. --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  03:34, 17 July 2007 (CEST)
 * Any indications as to good areas to farm? There are none contained within the article, or a hint at good potential enemies.  I remember using a barrage build to farm charcoal outside Lions Arch when I first started playing, and the infamous Battle of Turai farm but there must be better areas.  Tasha Darke 19:15, 22 July 2007 (CEST)
 * It's as simple as non-enchant stripping or knock down melee enemies mostly. I haven't done it in a loooong time but it used to be all the rage with farmers.  I'm not a big time farmer so I can't list the areas and enemies it's good against specifically.  --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  04:18, 25 July 2007 (CEST)

Wait, wait. Farm? This? By itself? Does not connect. -- Armond Warblade 06:08, 25 July 2007 (CEST)
 * I also agree, lets take farming off --[[Image:Flag of South Korea.png|22x22px]] Grumpy (Talk | Contrib) 22:23, 23 August 2007 (CEST)
 * There are always farming builds that use some variation of this general Barrage setup, but it's almost always a variation worthy of it's own page, or not worth mentioning IMO. (Splinter/Barrage, etc.) Farming tag should be removed, but perhaps a mention in Notes or something about how it's possible to use a Barrage setup for farming... --[[image:GEO-logo.png]] Jioruji Derako.> 14:58, 24 August 2007 (CEST)

I agree, remove farming tag... The only farming I've ever done with Barrage was exp farming for my Legendary Survivor (Spliter/Barrage in the Battle of Turai's Procession). Tain 05:50, 17 October 2007 (CEST)
 * The R/Mo variant with Live Vicariously and Vigorous Spirit can be used to farm Minotaurs in Elona Reach. It only works in normal mode which kinda sucks, and is not particularly efficient, but it can be done nonetheless! &mdash; Hyperion` // talk 21:52, 26 February 2008 (EST)

Is this good for AB?
Topic Doophus2 20:52, 9 August 2007 (CEST)
 * I'm punching the next guy that uses Barrage in PvP. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 21:12, 9 August 2007 (CEST)
 * I am going to do AB with barrage, just because you said that Rapta ;). Readem (talk *pvxcontribs ) 21:16, 9 August 2007 (CEST)
 * No joke but i only play R/Rt Splinter Barrage in AB, perfect solo capper and Anti kurz build in one. And a bit more survivability in mine, if i'm to fae a whole mob solo. 84.67.229.229 14:45, 9 April 2008 (EDT)
 * Please, don't. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 18:35, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

Wilderness Survival Too High
Troll unguent has the same duration for 10 and 11 wilderness survival, so the minor rune could be removed from it, or 1 point taken off and put elsewhere.
 * Good point. Could be put in Expertise for +1 second of Whirling Defense and also as a precaution against weakness.  -1 to all attributes from weakness will bring troll unguent down 1 regen but I think it's better to protect against Expertise being reduced below the sweet-spot instead as it'll effect the cost of Whirling and Savage.  This build was made before the change to Weakness so this is a very valid change to remove a point from WS to add it to Exp IMO. Worst case there's no Weakness and you still get an extra second of WD  --[[Image:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG]]  Vallen Frostweaver  22:56, 5 September 2007 (CEST)
 * +1 Regen is good, 1 second of WD doesn't make much of a difference anyways. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:05, 6 September 2007 (CEST)
 * Scratch that, nvm. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 22:11, 6 September 2007 (CEST)

Guide?
Archive this and turn it into a guide? PheNaxKian (T /c) 00:26, 26 October 2007 (CEST)
 * ...What? No. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 00:28, 26 October 2007 (CEST)

Only damage through Barrage?
Yeah Barrage is great on large mobs. But you may sometimes get a small mob or a large mob that is nicely spaced out. Barrage does medicore damage anyway, and favorable winds takes a little while to prepare. I really get tired of barraging anyway, and I usually change out the interrupts for damage skills like Pentrating and Sundering Shot. That's just me though. BTW, no way IN HELL this can be a farming build. Not unless you plan on farming things 10 lvls lower than you. --Guild of Deals 22:37, 26 October 2007 (CEST)
 * I direct you to Tombs. --24.82.162.222 22:42, 26 October 2007 (CEST)
 * this post made me lol myself .Alpha fireborn[[Image:Alpha Fireborn Cripshot.JPG|19px]] 22:57, 26 October 2007 (CEST)
 * It's farming and it uses Barrage rangers. QED. :) --24.82.162.222 23:04, 26 October 2007 (CEST)

Add Poison Tip Signet
Now that EoTN has come out, you could switch some of the non-important skills out for poison tip signet which in turn is just like using apply poison and barrage: poisoning a large amount of people at one time. Just a thought
 * Poison Tip Signet only works on the next attack. Attacking more than one enemy with Barrage counts as multiple attacks. Therefore, you will only poison one foe. Smooths 22:19, 29 December 2007 (EST)

Rune Suicide
for 2 extra damage?? Frans  04:07, 10 March 2008 (EDT)
 * It's Marksmanship. You get more bow damage. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 12:32, 10 March 2008 (EDT)
 * like 2 months late, but rune suicide = lol who cares in pve. I mean wtf is gonna spike you that you need to be running around with 600 health.  Antiarchangel [[Image:Antiarchangel No U Sig.png|19px]] TROLL  09:04, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Bad Math in Ranger/Rit build?
Expertise: 11 (+1) Marksmanship: 8 (+1 +3) Channeling: 12

I just tried to test this out, and lo and behold, 200 points isn't enough? At best, I am attrib 9 points shy of the 9 in marksmanship... Should channeling be 11 instead of 12?

mending touch in main bar?
i mean seriously everybody uses it  Antiarchangel  TROLL  08:02, 6 May 2008 (EDT)
 * errm, you do realize this is for PvE?  16:19, 17 May 2008 (EDT)
 * It's still superior to Antidote Signet. &not; Klump  eet  16:42, 17 May 2008 (EDT)
 * Yeah but the build can be run as R/any, so don't restrict it to R/mo by putting mending touch in the main bar. It's already listed in the /mo variants. -- BrianG 16:53, 17 May 2008 (EDT)

Summon Spirit to teleport favorable winds?
For impatient people. Should I add it? Lionfire 09:27, 9 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Impatient people should just gtfo guild wars and start learning to be patient tbh. Brandnew.  09:37, 9 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Anyway, Favorable Winds is really just a slight bonus. I wouldn't waste another skill for it. --[[Image:GoD Wario Sig.PNG]] * Wah Wah  Wah! * 09:41, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Lightning Reflexes???
Why on Earth isn't that skill in the build instead of Whirling Defense? Zuranthium 02:58, 24 July 2008 (EDT)
 * People must like the AoE, although the damage from it is very minimal. I prefer Lightning Reflexes, but if I;m not mistaken, IAS will interfere with your Barrage spam (depending on the attack rate of your bow, of course.) ــмıкε  нaшк  10:00, 24 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Because in PvE where monsters sometimes camp you and aggro doesn't break, you can sit there and spam Barrage for the next 20 seconds, and it usually recharges for the next mob anyways? Seemed logical. &mdash; Rapta  [[image:Rapta_Icon1.gif|19px]] (talk|contribs) 17:18, 24 July 2008 (EDT)
 * No experienced ranger really uses whirling over lightning and almost none take troll to pve so I changed the article slightly.
 * Expirienced rangers don't play PvE tbh ;) Brandnew.  05:48, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
 * Dwarven Stability gets u a whirling defense-ish effect-- Shadow [[Image:Relyk Sig.gif]] 02:22, 13 September 2008 (EDT)

Really not that great...
Am I the only person that really thinks barrage isn't a great skill anymore? Incendiary Arrows is less spammable, and only 3 targets, but instead of adjacent, its nearby, and can be used with preparations, and causes burning. Also, since it's in Wilderness Survival, it works very well with things like Ignite Arrows, which in turn can be used with dual shot and tripple shot, which I believe gives better damage than the standard and very old Barrage build.72.161.115.13 20:14, 12 February 2009 (EST)
 * Splinter barrage says hai2u  Life [[Image:Life Guardian-AoF.jpg|19px]] 21:08, 12 February 2009 (EST)
 * meh rangers do much better in pvp compared to pve [[Image:Muffin.jpg|19px]]P WNAGEMUFFIN   crabs  21:14, 12 February 2009 (EST)
 * This build fails unless you have a hero cast Splinter weapon on you. Constantly recasting SW on yourself really slows the build down. Rangers are a popular build but, although most people are reluctant to admit it, are really not that great on PvE. Compared to some of the overpowered PvE builds the Barrage build is weak. I would rate it 'Good', for it can be devastating, but definitely not 'Great'.--81.151.48.19 00:08, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, you're the only one who thinks Barrage isn't great. Barrage can be easily spammed in PvE through the minimum listed Expertise (8+1) and a Zealous bow.  Skill costs three Energy, you recharge at a rate of 2 pips per three seconds (or 1 energy per 1.5 seconds), meaning by the time you've cast Barrage and recharged the skill, you have already usually gained 1 point of Energy back in regen and only need to hit two targets per cast to completely make up the cost of the skill.  Which means you can spam it indefinitely for consistent +damage.  If you hit three or more targets per cast (which in most places in PvE, you will be able to if you are smart, even in HM), you're actually gaining energy per cast, allowing for use of other skills in between Barrage spam (such as YMLAD).  And that ignores the potential benefits of using this skill with a Vampiric bow, obviously.  This build is pretty good for pressure on the back row, honestly.  Even without Splinter Weapon, this build can be very useful for nailing AI-controlled caster monsters who don't tend to think of Barrage spam as a serious threat (since it's not technically deemed AoE damage by the AI, it won't tend to scatter them as an elementalist spell would).  You're absolutely nuts if you think it is a bad build. --BuildKitten 17:08, March 14, 2010 (UTC)

Mark of Rodgort
should is be added to the variants section as you can set multiple enemy's on fire for 2-3 seconds very time there hit with barrage?
 * Expertise does not lower the cost of secondary hex spells, so the ranger would spend alot of his energy on just maintaining MoR. Might cut down on you other damage because you cant use your other bow attacks.80.56.148.251 07:11, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

R/RT
Heres what i roll with: 1.Pain Inverter 2.Barrage 3.Savage Shot 4.Whirling Defense 5.Throw Dirt 6.I Am The Strongest 7.Splinter Weapon 8.Flesh of my Flesh

Marksmanship:11+1+3 Expertise:6 Wilderness Survival:6+2 Channeling Magic:10

Weapon: Ironwing Flatbow(Energy gain) Deldrimor Longbow(Piercing) Both are 20% dmg health over 50% and +30HP
 * Barrage has lots of variants. It's usually better to carry splinter weapon on a caster though (any Me, N, or E hero can just go /Rt for that). You have wilderness survival with no WS skills though and a serious lack of expertise... Toraen   talk  18:55, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Also hax. You can't have any weapon with +20% damage when OVER 50% Health (max for that is +15%). +20% is the weapon customization. Toraen   talk  18:59, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Antidote Signet
is mainbar. Why? It's a cute variant, but I don't see why it deserves mainbar. Enlighten me. Ben Tbh 07:11, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Mostly because this is ridiculously out of date. Feel free to update.  Life [[Image:WikiLOD7.gif]] 07:25, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

wall of optionals
tl;didn't use -- -Ch  ao  s is  gay -   16:58, September 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * theres a shit load of shitty ones there ;p cba to go through it properly. Far better than it was though. Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]Feya  17:12, September 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * Barrage + Vigorous Spirit + Live Vicariously is obviously a winning concept. -- -Ch  ao  s is  gay -   19:04, September 30, 2009 (UTC)

Favorable Winds mainbar is good in theory but slow as hell. Also, suggestions for optimal mainbar? -- -Ch  ao  s is  gay -   14:41, October 2, 2009 (UTC)

You know its true - Athrun <font color="CornflowerBlue">Feya  14:42, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * lol'd irl, then just insert splinter or something tbh. -- -Ch  ao  s is  gay -   14:45, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * *cough* Almost a year later... and its still true! Really. Nice suggestions on the three on the page that are not barrage, but honestly they're just more optionals. Particularly if you're a human. Then you lag and ranger interrupts aren't good for shit! The list of optionals on the page are great though, good for giving ideas. A few fuller suggestion bars might be nice though, lay out splinter barrage or SY barrage some more, since there literally are 7 optional slots. darkoak 08:28, July 18, 2010 (UTC)

Ele Optionals
who put intensity on there? since it doesnt actually affect the conjures?--92.27.50.36 22:56, January 19, 2010 (UTC)

Heroes
don't spam Barrage (or offensive skills in general) very well; they'd be better off with Volley and a different Elite (BHA, or go P/R), tbh. ــѕт. мıкε  15:00, April 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * just go R/P and fill half the build with shouts, then they have no choice but to spam barrage. - <font color="SteelBlue">Athrun <font color="Black">Feya [[Image:Lau_bfly.gif]] - 15:07, April 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * The problem isn't casting times; they just don't spam Barrage. I've tested P/R with Command Shouts, and even when they have more than enough Energy and could hit several targets, they won't spam Barrage (which fuels "Go for the Eyes!", which fuels Barrage XD). They used Barrage perhaps once every 4 seconds, on average, although it was a while ago since I tested this. Heroes will spam when you don't want them to, but they won't when you do want them to (offensive skills). >.> ــѕт.  мıкε  15:13, April 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well i found it was far better with just a few shouts (..and one or two empty skill slots). I use to use one as an effective splinter distributor/technobabble triggerer for general vanqs and stuff... - <font color="SteelBlue">Athrun <font color="Black">Feya [[Image:Lau_bfly.gif]] - 15:18, April 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Heroes don't tend to spam much of ANYTHING all that well, except interrupts (one of the few things they can do well) and things like Death Nova. Barrage is no exception.  Regardless, they still tend to do more damage via Barrage than with other elites, so it remains one of the better hero options for a Ranger hero.  BuildKitten 17:10, April 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * That's arguable; you can't expect to hit any more foes with Barrage versus Volley, and with an open Elite, you could take Enraged Lunge for additional single-target DPS, Infuriating Heat to increase the DPS of your physicals, Incendiary Arrows (with Ingite Arrows, and EBSoH on your own bar). There's really very little benefit (maybe 3 more DPS per hit from Barrage versus Volley) to running Barrage over Volley on Heroes. ــѕт.  мıкε  18:10, April 24, 2010 (UTC)

Interrupting
Wait.. so why are there interrupt skills here? Are you barraging with a recurve bow? Isn't that a bad idea? If you're using a longbow, you really can't interrupt anything except for super-duper-long skills. Enlighten me, I really want to use a barrage build, but I'm seriously considering not taking Savage OR distracting shot. I mean, I know you guys have a fetish for interrupting, but my heroes do that enough already. I'm really not sure why you'd take them in a barrage build - by the time the arrows hit, your target has already cast the spell. And if you use a recurve bow, you're too close.
 * you have discovered why rangers suck with bows-- Relyk  talk  03:49, June 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I heard it's amazing what can happen when people use proper weapon swaps, but lolpve.

reelak, rangers dont suck with bows, the guys that rated barrage dual rupter heros in pve with GREAT are the ones that suck...and heros use barrage every 5 or 6 secs anyway, at least for most of time, they dont spam it like humans...so, basically, this sucks in reality...if u guys need a skill that rupts shit, use pdrain, rupts are only useful in rare situations in pve, and only caster-bound rupts are needed (if they are, i suggest pdrain coz at 8 insp magic u get 17 energy)...heros spam IA as often as barrage, i prefer IA, it allow preps, and at even 4 ws u get 2 secs burn, 28dmg ot...


 * this is not a hero build! heroes are able to use it...so its tagged hero usage...but they are stupid and why the hell should anyone use ranger heroes over necros or rits? this bar is fine, there is no reason to change it because your heroes suck at using barrage.Illoyon 13:23, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

--Legendary Catrin 11:56, August 1, 2010 (UTC) heroes with barrage are fail

Since when is a barrage hero meta 0__0''
 * We can't tag them separately without making two different pages (one for players and one for heroes). And that would be unnecessary. <font face="Courier New" color="Black">Toraen <font face="Courier New" color="DarkGoldenrod">TheJanitor [[image:ToraenSig2.png]] 03:03, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

Why not take all the spirits?
Should be pretty useful with the right team, always wondered why people bothered splitting these spirits among separate team members for team builds since one player alone can easily do the attribute split to make them all useful and this way only one ranger needs to have summon spirits. Variations would be make beast mastery the highest atribute instead of marksmanship to make EoE stronger and maybe take some other BM skills, and/or taking a rez, distracting shot can go if interrupts are covered and someone else can easily take the standard. Necromas 21:24, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Marks: 11 + 2-4
 * Beast: 10 + 1
 * Exp: 7 + 1
 * Wild:7 + 1
 * It's because people don't generally enjoy taking 20 secs to prep up spirits before a fight when they could take 5 each and get to it earlier. But hey, if you don't mind the wait, go for it. Should help with team compression with whatever team you are using to support you.68.111.174.90 05:51, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Asuran Ice Imp
Great snare to delay/prevent spreading, plus you don't even have to do the snaring yourself. Maybe not good for the mainbar, but definitely should belong to the optional.

Removal of the ritualist weapon spells
There's seven heroes and SoS spammers are pretty common in groupings of people. I don't think there's any need anymore to have those for the build. They often lower your DPS or hurt your energy anyway. Discuss. Cuilan 05:16, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Not like you have anything better to bring though-- Relyk 05:24, 20 August 2011 (UTC)
 * gw:Bull's Strike Brandnew.  10:17, 20 August 2011 (UTC)

Meta for pug rangers?
Go on tell me I'm terrible - but don't pug rangers run barragers as their staple build? <font face="Calibri" color="Black" size="2.5">Chieftain <font face="Calibri" color=CC6633 size="2.5"> Alex  15:45, 26 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Probably. But it's such a crappy build... -- Jai . -  16:26, November 26 2011 (UTC)

Old
Might just be a noob thought, but isn't barrage builds kinda outdated with everything else? Dacookiemaster 16:15, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Rangers in general are a bit outdated. --Master Elros 18:38, 23 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Ranger is probably the worst PvE profession, so, no, as elros said, its the ranger that is outdated. Silen†   18:41, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Splinter Weapon
Was there a reason to keep this out of the optionals, but taking stuff like command shouts? Just looks a bit odd to me. --Krschkr (talk) 09:26, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Late response, but generally you should let a support character cast splinter on you for better use of attributes and time across the team. A barrage ranger (or any physical) should be spending as much time as possible actually attacking. The SoS rit that most teams have generally has plenty of time to cast splinter on recharge. It's a powerful combo (well, any physical+splinter is) but there's not much reason to squeeze the skills onto one character in most situations. 14-16 spec splinter is also a huge difference from the 10 spec you'd be able to fit on this bar.
 * If you have a PuG team of 3-5 physicals then obviously some of them are not getting any splinter weapon even with an extra copy, but coordinated teams like that aren't really in wide use. Though such teams tend to use GDW to supplement splinter. -Toraen (talk) 00:41, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The majority of pug ritualists refuses to support their team with weapon spells though (which is my reason to kick them out of the team if I made the pug...) and even assuming a splinter weapon support from the team it often takes a good while until you get one. I don't think it's a bad optional skill, especially in comparison to suggestions like "go for the eyes!", which require a large amount of bone fiends to be worth it. Doesn't work on all barrage arrows, after all, just one of them. --Krschkr (talk) 12:30, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * GftE also benefits any other physical players in the team, but I agree it's not that useful to the ranger without something that triggers on crit (I think that list begins and ends with Keen Arrow for barrage rangers). Most of the time when I played ranger though, I only went bow if I wanted to provide reliable SY support to my heroes. So I'm considering making R/W the mainbar and leaving other options as variants. -Toraen (talk) 23:52, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
 * R/W as the mainbar sounds good to me!--Saxazaxx (talk) 02:26, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm fine with R/W as the main bar. --Krschkr (talk) 14:08, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Pet+NRA mainbar as well? Or should the attributes be left open? LR mainbar without DS mainbar is kinda weak for IAS (and I prefer maintainable IAS to begin with). -Toraen (talk) 15:06, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't mainbar the pet, rather drop the ias from the main bar and leave it up to the player whether he picks frenzy, lightning reflexes or whatever else pleases them. --Krschkr (talk) 16:56, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Variants
I think we should convert this page to variantbars to present builds that are a bit more substantial. Something like these:

Also make superior marksmanship mainbar. Toraen (talk) 19:59, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * I have some doubts about the merits of barrage outside of SY spam or splinter weapon application, especially in case of the R/P. Some thoughts: Conjure Lightning would allow to bring shell shock + body shot for energy management. R/Rt would allow the same with sundering weapon and body shot. Due to either not having a zealous weapon on the R/E energy might be tough without that, in case of the R/Rt the weapon spell spam may indtroduce a need for energy management aswell. We may want to use drunken master as the mainbar IAS and keep the alternatives in the variants. --Krschkr (talk) 11:48, 9 April 2021 (UTC)
 * R/P: Yeah, after actually trying to build it out, I'm not seeing the appeal. It just seems like a very low value for a player's skill slots.
 * R/E: is questionable but at least does present some synergies. Shell Shock+Body Shot doesn't return very much energy right away, but Cracked Armor is useful for its own sake and you can get 2 Body Shots off per Shell Shock. EDIT: without overcast it's not very good, I wouldn't mainbar it.
 * R/Rt: I actually don't like the Nightmare Weapon combo very much, it's very energy intensive for a mediocre return (111 lifesteal for 2 skills costing 11e and cast+aftercast+attack... every 11s). Probably relegate it to variants. Sundering+Body shot does seem like it'd be useful, even though it can't spread cracked armor very far.
 * Drunken Master: Probably should be mainbar. It's the most efficient IAS and every variant I've suggested here has room for it.


 * These perhaps? Conjure variant can drop SS/BS if some spirit is needed but they're pretty niche variants usually. Forgot about overcast requirement, SS is at best a variant mention I feel. Not sure about a pet variant, but if we include one it pretty much removes any reasonable investment in a secondary if you want the pet to do anything other than enable NRA. Toraen (talk) 12:20, 9 April 2021 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't mainbar the cracked armor + body shot combos, but if they feel worth playing they could be added to the variants for energy management/single target debuffing. With ebon standard of honour and cracked armour it won't matter much that you're not effective against single targets, since you make up for it by buffing the bone fiends you should probably have in your team build. With your support they'll eliminate single targets for you.
 * Needle shot is probably good enough for the mainbar in the SY build to increase the adrenaline gain against single targets?
 * Agree that the nightmare weapon combo does not look particularly efficient. --Krschkr (talk) 12:48, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

R/E Together as One Volley
trash in favor of barrage. TaO + volley should just be added as variant to barrage page. Willarddog (talk) 16:26, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Yea, I don't have super strong feelings about this bar. It seemed alright in terms of damage spikes + team support, but barrage certainly does damage spikes better. The health regen is probably not a major benefit at the end of the day. I rated this as 3.8 so a simple 3.0 rating should bring it to trash status :D. I don't have a strong opinion about adding it as a variant to barrage either. Us3r1OO425457 (talk) 13:53, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * If this should be trashed, then it wouldn't make sense to add it to Barrage as a variant (since that would allow this build to sneak past vetting). Either it is good enough to store in some manner or it isn't. Toraen (talk) 16:21, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * "it wouldn't make sense to add it to Barrage as a variant" Except it would. Anything a Barrage ranger can do, a ToA + volley ranger can do. Slight differences (volley is scuffed, ToA le physical damage buff, le hp regen). There is absolutely no reason to recreate the pages. If you really want them to stay separate, all you have to do is merge this + the "defensive" page, and copy + paste the barrage page word for word except simply change out Barrage for ToA + volley.
 * It's literally the exact same build. Willarddog (talk) 19:29, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I was responding to "trash in favor of barrage", which would seem to imply that you think this isn't good enough. Though Volley is significantly worse than Barrage (less than half the potential damage output type of worse) and Volley+TaO relies entirely on having enough martial party members to take advantage of it to outperform Barrage in total damage. If it still affected minions/spirts then I'd probably have looked at this more favorably. It probably is worth a variant mention for those parties, but I wouldn't recommend it for all parties. Toraen (talk) 22:01, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * You've made solid points; Don't get me wrong, It's not an ineffective build by all means. You're right that it's not trash worthy. It's just an inferior variant of barrage in 95% of scenarios. It fulfills the exact same niche as barrage while dealing less damage except in one specific scenario where you have "martial party members". The main point being missed here is that the primary strength of barrage is not damage, but utility. Sure, it has some good synergy with skills such as splinter weapon, but as evidenced by "SY!" being mainbarred on the barrage page, and also with "This PvE-oriented Ranger/Warrior build uses the elite skill Barrage to deal steady AoE damage and rapidly build adrenaline for "Save Yourselves!"". Volley is never (effectively) used for damage, but utility. If you're looking to support martial allies while dealing good damage, we already have a ToA bow spam and ToA dagger spam. ToA Volley just doesn't need it's own page. All you have to do to make this is to take the barrage build and replace Barrage with ToA + Volley. The build page would still be the exact same. We have multiple builds on PvX which have variant elite skill slots; I don't see the problem with adding it as a variant in this scenario. The other problem with this build I have is that it mainbars Conjure. Sure, it adds some damage, but with this build you'll likely need to use a zealous bow a good bit. Conjure should be listed as an optional. Without conjure, Barrage deals more damage than this build simply because of the shorter cooldown and more potential foes. Willarddog (talk) 14:23, 6 April 2021 (UTC)