User talk:Innoruuk/Build:Team - UW Spirit Teams/Archive 1

That is a huge Wall-o-Text. Drahgal Meir 02:28, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
 * ^ O.O' -- Ikimono "My beard is thick." [[Image:Monk-Paragon-icon.png|24px]] 20:03, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
 * This for NM or HM? 118.92.166.13 07:41, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

ETA
As mentioned above, is this for nm or hm? and how long does it take to complete?--TahiriVeila 12:10, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

So everytime i come back to read this page, I look at the BOOK that lays before me and exit the tab to go back to having fun. If there's anyway to actually Speed up a build made for UWSpeedC then that's probably a good idea.-- Ikimono "My beard is thick."  00:39, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

So you going to answer the question or not? It seems to be a viable build but a wall of text is going to turn people off and if you keep defending it, it is going to be taken down and might result in a ban. --DarkEnzanArikado 01:47, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

PvX:OWN
Please take the time to read it. It doesn't matter who makes a build, even if you are the first one to do so. If you don't want to follow the policies here, put a deletion tag on it now and stop contributing. I'm not trying to scare you off (I'm actually interested in the build), but I'd rather this didn't end in drama and bans. Toraen  talk  01:21, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I say you should put a deletion tag on it.
 * WHY THE FUCK DOES THE PAGE START OFF WITH YOU TALKING ABOUT YOUR LACK OF KNOWLEDGE ON WIKI CODING?
 * They're called fucking talk pages, and dear God I've seen shorter novels... A_F_K_sig_2.jpg A F K When Needed 13:20, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Linking
I'm not even going to hazard a guess why you think Shadowsong will link to something. This is a wiki about builds. Not skills, not the game in general, builds. Thus, PvXWiki will not have an article about each skill, savvy? Nobody cares how experienced you are when it comes to editing wikis, but if you show signs of having no more common sense than the average table leg, people won't be inclined to help you. If you, against the odds, show signs you've actually read this, more tips might come along. No more essays on Build articles, please. A F K When Needed 13:29, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Tip #1 - do not start of a build article (or let such a page so much as include) waffle about you and pretty much anything about you. No offense intended (unlike my previous edit on this page) but we really care.
 * Tip #2 - it's a wiki, people will edit the page, don't waste time asking for help.
 * Tip #3 - tl;dr = Too Long; Didn't Read. You'll see this a lot in future, so I thought I'd inform you of it's meaning.
 * Hey anyone think it's a good idea to like at the end make /walkthrough link and move the wall 'o' text over there instead? i'll go do it if so. Mooter  -  talk | contrib 13:31, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes and no.
 * I'd say he's new. While helping him's cool, I'd be more inclined to try and get him to do it correctly than do things for him - that way he won't learn.
 * Feel free to suggest it to him on his Talk Page. A_F_K_sig_2.jpg A F K When Needed 13:35, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * The talk page he knows not exsists :< fair enough though. Mooter  -  talk | contrib 13:36, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * (EC) Oh, and I did that badly. Read "I'd say... won't learn" as one sentence. :P
 * I did say "his talk page", which unlike the rest of the response wasn't a typo / bad failing at sentences in general. When you edit that he'll... probably... notice it. A_F_K_sig_2.jpg A F K When Needed 13:38, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Agree
Tell me how, and I will obey. Sorry, I didn't know this talk page was here. I would have responded much sooner. If you can tell me where to put my "book," and how, I will place it there with a link on the build page. --Innoruuk


 * Well I suggest making the walkthrough on your userpage http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/User:Innoruuk/uwsc_walkthrough <-- click that then create the page. Then simply cut and paste the big novel of a walkthrough :P on that page. save it then at the bottom of your build page put this

== Walkthrough == User:Innoruuk/uwsc_walkthrough

Mooter -  talk | contrib 13:43, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Moving On
Ok, now that I've listed the information you all wanted, and the build page fits all the "completed" criteria, could we start vetting please? Someone apparently thinks this build article needs to be cleaned up, but I've read the guidelines over and over again. If you have a concern, post it here instead of leaving the author to look everywhere for either an impossibly too small to detect or some totally irrelevant bit that no one else cares about because you're just anal. --Innoruuk
 * "No one cares . . . because you're just anal." I think you should fit in quite well on PvX. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 14:27, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

It doesnt matter who created the spirit you can only have up 1 spirit at a time, so after one rit casts bloodsong/ vampirism, the next rit eho casts them will make the 2 earlier ones die. so no matter what this build fails, srry, ive had to learn that the hard way also-68.227.202.180 21:23, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
 * You fail fucking hard. Read the book of a walkthrough at the bottom of the page. -- Jai Goes Monksassin Monksassin-icon.png 21:28, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

The build as it is is just a serious overkill if intended for 7 rits and 1 assasin.

Signer of Spirits has 20 sec recharge: Lets say you bring 3 of those and you have plenty allready. So why not bring 2 wanderlust aswell, but still youre going to have plenty of overkill left in the team.. Necro secoundary and grab necrosis on ALL of the characters, giving you far more damage. Then add in an actual N\Me (or N\Rt)SS nuker with barbs and shadow of fear (allso packing necrosis) and at last you do a N\Mo or something BiP necromancer. Might even add in You Move Like a Dwarf and Ebon Vanguard Assasin on all or some of the characters aswell.

This has a lot of potencial but for now much of it is wasted.

This is not a complete build.. Finish it, think again.


 * You do realize that only in the mountains will the four/five ritualists be "wasting" potential. They split into two teams at the Chaos Plains to clear both sides much more quickly, and after Four Horsemen, they split to Bone Pits and the Spawning Pools. Read the walkthrough I painstakingly wrote (with a couple grammatical errors left to weed out) before assuming a buildmaker failed at his job. If you don't know how it works, you ask questions. Don't assume something when you don't know the concepts. I am removing the cleanup tag because now you have your answer, and I hate having my vetting slowed by nimrods. 15:37, September 1, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * My guildies and I toyed with a similar concept a while back and originally utilised Rt/Mo builds. After a few runs, we easily sped it up by changing secondaries about, since Res Scrolls are available to all, we decided on taking these instead and opening the 8th skill slot to a variety of other options. All you are using /Mo here is for is Rebirth.  Some of these secondary options have been mentioned above.  Certainly EVAS is a viable option too, especially for Behemoth trap triggering, thus saving you time here and there.  Also we found that EVAS lasts a small amount of time against Terrorwebs, thus taking the focus away from the spirits/ritualist(s).  I recall at least one of our rits running Technobabble too, handy for interrupts and potential issue management.  This kinda setup is indeed fun and, when played right, could be a fun alternative to UWSC runs (or for those who don't run Sins).  But I agree, there is a lot of potential to this but could do with some more work (based upon the comments made by me and others).--Ying Tze 01:28, September 2, 2009 (UTC)


 * Thank you. Finally! I get a smart one! I value your input, I do, and I have in fact been toying with such concepts as EVAS spam. However, you must realize that this is only a basic guideline. Obviously there will be people good enough who will not require rebirth or are willing to spend the money on ressurection scrolls. The whole point of this build was to nullify the need for using said consumables, but it is a totally viable option. Do you honestly think people would only adhere to the builds given? You, the smarter than average monkey game players who actually exist, are responsible for finding better ways to farm. My UWSC Ritway has its ups and downs. More time, but more drops, and no paying for cons. Please, I do emplore all of you to put down relevant ideas here. No more trashing, especially the dumbasses who don't get it because they either only have ever perma'd in their gw careers or have not read the guide I made. Place down ideas, cause this is where others will be looking in the future. Thank you very much for your cooperation, and in advance, all senseless bashers should go get a tutor, cause I'm pretty sure your single-mindedness going on arrogance is forcing your school grades to suffer. Ciao for now. 04:16, September 2, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * Np Innoruuk, however I'll add a couple more suggestions. 1.) you might want to add a "Variations" section to each of the builds, since the "general" PvX user will pick these builds up and run only these.  If you can add the suggestions of running EVAS, Techno etc etc, then at least people will be aware of the differences available.  2.) Since the focus presently seems to be on how quickly everything can be done, I would assume that people would prefer running a damage skill in slot 8 instead of Rebirth (since res scrolls are inexpensive to craft given the amount of money that is easily made in UW from the drops alone), so again you might want to point this out.  Will have a look further when I get chance, since Wanderlust is also missing here and would be a huge benefit to the overall clearance. --Ying Tze 10:29, September 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * Nothing as annoying as retarded OP's flaming left and right because people critizise their builds ey?
 * I will take that comment with a grain of salt. I am easy to anger by stupid people. When I say stupid, it means nothing as to your potential. I'm saying you're not using your intellect to its fullest. It is my personal belief that we all have the same intellectual abilities, limits, and potentials, but some use theirs more often than others and thus get ahead. Flexing the brain will open paths to anything in life. Experience and constant thought will provoke creative ideas which can be tested for effectiveness. This sounds like technobabble I know, but really it is simple. Think, and your thinking will eventually get faster, more creative, more expansive, and more comprehensive. I lived a pretty tough life, having to grow up in a house with warring parents and a brother I pretty much had to raise myself, so I had to think often. I also have Ausberger's Syndrome, so if I sound snobby, I apologize in advance. Note: if you look it up, there are two "main" manifestations. I have the one where it doesn't make me academically challenged, but socially inept. Innoruuk

Whys it UWSC?
Whys it named under world speed clear? lol its kinda looks like under world slow clear.


 * Ball monsters, place spirits and cast Painful Bond. Shit explodes. Same sequence as Manlyway (different words used, though. Spirits -> Hexes, Painful Bond -> Hundred Blades/FGJ/TTL/WWA), but maybe takes a second or 2 more per group. Drama. --- [[Image:VipermagiSig.JPG]] -- (contribs) &emsp;(talk)  20:21, September 1, 2009 (UTC)
 * Reread painful bond, kthnx. Life   Guardian  04:32, September 2, 2009 (UTC)

2 quick questions
1) how noob-proof is this compared to the popular uwsc? 2) any chance on seeing some vids? Lยкץ๒๏ץ talk  11:08, September 3, 2009 (UTC)
 * I swear to you that this build is the closest thing to noob-proof as it gets. You have infinite ressing, excellent if not perfect energy management, and people are on reserve in some cases just in case a whole team manages to fail. As per vids, I wish I could get a team patient enough to keep going and learn it enough so I could videotape something that isn't pathetic. People can be so arrogant, stupid perma-only people....No offense to those who only perma but realize that they are not the only way to win the game, that invincibuilds are not everything.Innoruuk
 * Well for the vids you don't have to get the full team do you? only the people that are needed to clear the route your filming. I have a rit on my other acc, but that only has factions. I could help out if needed Lยкץ๒๏ץ talk  13:50, September 3, 2009 (UTC)

i even tested my theory, you cannot have 2 of the same type of spirit out at once on the mini map circle (not the agro circle, the BIG cricle where ur agro circle is inside of), so once u use SoS, ur spirits will come, and all of ur friends spirits will disapeer of the face of the earth (well in this case, underworld). so in the end, Spirits cancel each other out, this is a uber fail build. ull only have like 3 or 4 spirits out outa time. if this didnt happen, ppl sould go all out a full rit team, 7 spirit spammers, and 1 energy free healer rit.68.227.202.180 22:51, September 3, 2009 (UTC)
 * I think you have ur wires crossed, or your minimap is much smaller than mine. Shout range. And you do realize the only location this pertains to is the Vale team making the right-wing cross to the reaper room? The point of having 4 mtn rits in the Mountains is to replace, because Behemoths can give nasty damage if you don't watch it. In my guide I call it the retracting spirit wall, replacing spirits as they die so that there is no true downtime for any spirit if it is killed by ultra powerful melee such as aatxes or aoe spikes. In Chaos Plains, the space is so great that you have no worries as to multiple teams working. Your theory had grounds, but you misinterpreted both the build and the purposes. Innoruuk

Speed
Don't think this question has been answered. Can you do this in HM? Are the times at all comparabled to a standard UWSC? If you can't do this in a half hour or less then it's pointless as experienced permas will finish UW in under 10 mins.--TahiriVeila 03:29, September 4, 2009 (UTC)
 * Read the top of the build page, and remember that you get triple the drops of a normal run because you're actually killing stuff, but a balanced team would take hours, so this is "speedy," just not cop-out speedy. You shouldn't be able to skip foes and just beat a few select enemies. When you can kill stuff, you have skills. Running takes none except in a few very strict situations. So the amount of money made is much greater than a sinway run, but you have to actually work for it, which makes it fun for those (like my alliance who is now testing this) who get bored doing the same old routine. To answer your stupid question, yes it does HM. If you are wondering why your question is stupid, follow the first sentence in this paragraph. Note: the build page has not been editted in I think 2 or 3 weeks. Innoruuk

This is the stupidiest idea I have ever seen. I am a fan of the rit but why the hell would u bring in 4 rits with the same build.... why not bring a rit 1 and rit2 (created by the BOA guild which has created the 35-40 min rit way deep runs with no cons) and then bring support.... If the group is going to split up than bring 2 rit 1s and 2 rit 2s acompany with a hybrid healer roj
 * Once again, you don't understand the concepts which I heavily explain and elaborate on in my guide. The reason you have four-five Mountain and Beyond Ritualists with basically the same skills is that damage rates in the Mountains area is very high, and it's ranged. Spirits can often be destroyed, so reapplication is key to keep the operation moving. You can't hex in the Chaos Plains, so inevitably the mindblades will take longer, thus giving time for spirits to run out/die. AoE damage spikes in the Pools works the same way. As long as you have spirits, you're invincible, and without them, you're a sitting duck. Also, since Roj's AI reaction was switched, I'd disagree with you and say bring energy surge, empathy, spirit shackles, mind wrack, fragility...etc. Innoruuk
 * There is a point, though, in the fact that if you have different spirits they can, to a certain extend, be used either together or apart (in different locations or one after the other) as needed whereas if you bring many copies of the same ones you don't have that option. Currently you have 4 bloodsongs and 4 vampirisms. As great as those spirits are, there are many others (e.g. Dissonance, another Pain or Shadowsong et.c.) that you could take which would allow you to speed things up when two or more rits are in the same location as each other. You could even bring Gaze of Fury and only use it when a given spirit has already recharged (or is about to die or whatever) so you know you can afford it, though I don't know how well (or not) that would work. 82.3.249.58 16:56, September 6, 2009 (UTC)
 * That is certainly a possibility, but for the higher damage areas of UW such as Pits and the Chamber, it would be...risky is not the right word, but it could make things difficult. Perhaps this would work better in a place with enemy spirits. I wish they made more god realms.

the Perma
I am actually working on somehting like this, too =) (http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:Team_-_4-Man_UW_HM). All I want to menion is that the perma will might be having some difficulties killing the the vengefuls in the chamber becuase of that beautifulk fact thaet they CANT take Damage! I suggest either using the original perma build for chamber or using the 330 rit. I'd gladly like to help you, PM me if you need help with anything =) (IGN: Misai Jen) 195.181.32.133 05:08, September 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * You don't kill vengefuls. You kill the keepers. &mdash; Balistic PvX 19:20, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

Permas getting nerfed soon ppl
So i herd the new live test krewe will be nerfing permas again soon, it's time to wake up and smell the air people, permas wont always be the fastest speed clear after the nerf, because they even specifically said "Just to confirm - Shadow Form is on the Live Team's big list of things to do this year" ~Twitter. Good luck sitcking behind your perma theory. κʊʀʐɨᴄκ ᴀᴋᴀ  [|ᴀᴍᴀᴛᴇᴜᴙ] 00:51, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
 * K, ur a shitter. Plus obby flesh is just as fast and way safer. Life   Guardian  00:53, September 9, 2009 (UTC)
 * ^ Just means people will run E/ME terras with Obby flesh + stoneflesh again--TahiriVeila 20:29, September 10, 2009 (UTC)

Designing an alternative to the Perma UWSC is potentially interesting, just for the fact that other characters exist in GW then perma assassins. Perma uwsc may never be surpassed in time, until the SF nerfbat hits them hard, but this appears a viable team build. Haven't tested whether spirit cancelling will be an issue but I guess distances are far enough for multiple spirits of the same kind to co-exist. I also agree with the comments of others that some variation could be thought of in better utilisation of secondary prof skills (Silicon Based 06:52, September 29, 2009 (UTC)).

Behemoths
I noticed that behemoths often can't recognize target and they stop attacking while being attacked by spirits. Has somebody experienced simmilar bug?--PlArc 13:32, September 10, 2009 (UTC)


 * Don't trust it as far as you can throw it. Yes, this bug occurs, but the second you let your guard down, they know it. They just do. Gained many a dp like this. Innoruuk

Rename
From UWSC Ritway to Sliver Perma Tank & addons

Energy Paranoia
Whoever made this build probably shivered behind his spirit wall, unwilling to cast any more before full energy bar... ANY of these builds is perfectly manageable with Spirit Syphon (or tbh even without due to skill CD)! Boot boon imho, it will work... 89.253.165.112 16:32, September 16, 2009 (UTC) Seal (the Ditzy Dame)

Rebirth
Soooooo many copies of rebirth. Why? -- Drah 02:20, September 23, 2009 (UTC)
 * Because, as we all know, things can go wrong in the UW when you don't use a cop-out build like permaway. As long as everyone can res, the fight can go on without much cause for alarm. Also, it's the second safest res except for unyielding aura. Also, I need one final say. Do you guys think this is ready for testing? I honestly do considering the build functions and has been proven to work. If not, please stop wasting my time, throw the challenges out there, and let's get rolling. Innoruuk

sssss
FUCKING VOTE FOR IT OR FUCKING REMOVE IT I CANT LOOK AT IT ANYMORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 * No... T1Cybernetic 17:51, September 24, 2009 (UTC)

Agreed, vetting time is here, and please, be object, not simple-minded. The purpose of this build is not to replace or compete with UWSC Sinway. It is an alternative for people who want to clear the UW on characters other than an Assassin. 02:17, September 29, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * noone cbf because you'll be confrontational once and while its trash voted. pvx in general doesnt host every single build that works, or is fun, etc. here really we keep and archive what is meta. someone should have slapped a WELL tag on this months ago. Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]Feya  02:35, September 29, 2009 (UTC)

CBF meaning? Sry, I suck with acronyms. So what, do only the "known people's" builds get hosted? This is a community site, and currently it seems like you have a personal beef with me. Why does this build deserve well status? If you have anything for variants or any suggestions, you should post them. I simply let it remain on trial for a while so that people would quit bitching about how this or that could work and I was stupid. I honestly can't say anything more? What do you want from me? 02:50, September 29, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * cbf means can't be fucked. Only "known people's" builds are vetted because the community trusts them and thinks that they are probably not shitters (which they are). Lastly, this deserves a well because it is simply inferior to a normal UWSC build. It doesn't matter if this is more fun. -- <font color="Black">Drah 02:55, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * personal beef is the tastiest kind. also spot on about the confrontational part <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  11:08, September 29, 2009

Yes, it may be slower, but you get more money (way more drops, almost every single one yielding loot), uses no consumables(thus adding to money made), allows completion of the Underworld on something other than a Perma, and by that I mean FULL Underworld, chest and all. It fulfills the purpose rather well, and it provides an opportunity not before available (expanded upon for those of you who will argue about the uw spirit solo and others). Can someone other than Feya explain to me why that constitutes a well or being torn from PVX altogether? By the way, Feya, I will submit and let you well my build (I'd prefer meta since it is still highly useful and unique) if I get a similar response from the admin. Until that point, they are watching this page too. Your vulgarity and harassment had best find their boundaries. Your vote will also be invalidated on this build as well until such point that they agree with you or find your messages here excusable. 18:51, September 29, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * Read though PvX:WELL, it is rather clear. You have to understand many things work in many areas in PvE, and on a simple level, things are often defined in terms of time taken - this build realistically shouldn't take 30 minutes longer than ordinary UWSC (i'm guessing, no where has there been proof of time taken, just very vague estimations), without a pretty good reason (see 2 and 3 man UW clearing builds). If/when SF/cons are nerfed then builds such as this one will become viable and you're welcome to keep this on your userspace until then. At present though, while UWSC exists in its current form, I can't see PvX hosting any other full UWSC builds. By the way, I'm a Build Master here, that would basically make me an admin as far as builds are concerned. For now, the WELL tag stays and if you revert persistantly you may be banned. <font color="Maroon">Athrun [[image:Athrun_Sig.gif]]<font color="Grey">Feya  19:33, September 29, 2009 (UTC)

That does not mean the build is not viable, does not perform the task it was designed for well, and is not useful for other places. I think you forget the criterion used to actually grade a build. FOW is done quite timely as well, and the drops are far more numerous. And I can keep reverting with the permission of OTHER admin. (I have at least 2, waiting on more) One is not the ultimate power. This build is viable, it is unique, it performs splendidly in many other areas. This is not meant to be as competition, and I believe that you can allow the vetting process can you not? Let the community decide, not one, single, air-headed, arrogant, perma-mentalled, brutish, pea-brained, and confrontational "master." Build master, HAH! What a laugh. There is a limit, but per say, you can keep coming up with amazing builds to the end of the horizon. I can also report you for misuse of administrative powers Feya, and the proof is sitting in this talk page. Let the people decide, and if the build falls on its own, it falls and we're through. You are not dealing with your average teenager, of that you have been fairly warned, by myself and other PVX admin. 20:24, September 29, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk

"Makes improper claim with current title which threatens livelihood of the build"
I lol'd really fucking hard. --  Jai  writes a  lot . . . 23:09, September 29, 2009 (UTC)

Well Tag Removal
Now that the build conforms better with PVX standards, Admin Danny deems it reasonable to remove current WELL tag. Also, can I wipe both my and the build's talkpages now that the topics are irrelevant to both the build and have no current purpose existing in them? Innoruuk 23:18, September 29, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * No sir, however, you may PW:ARCHIVE. Life   Guardian  23:20, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * Lol extra fucking hard for thinking Danny's an admin. --[[Image:Jaigoda_endrant.jpg|/rant]]  Jai  writes a  lot . . . 23:21, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * Also lol for thinking Danny's on your side when he posted in several places that you're a retarded autist. --[[Image:Jaigoda_endrant.jpg|/rant]]  Jai  writes a  lot . . . 23:30, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * autist. --<font color=Orange face="Comic Sans MS">Shazzy diddles 23:38, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * In my defense, I was really tired that night, and just felt like trolling. Was pretty much a joke build anyway. --[[Image:Jaigoda_endrant.jpg|/rant]]  Jai  writes a  lot . . . 23:41, September 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * I've had the moments <font color=Orange face="Comic Sans MS">Shazzy diddles 23:42, September 29, 2009 (UTC)

WHAT THE FREAKING HELL?
I have archived exactly to your parameters, using the correct codes and all. Either ur dense, or you forgot to revise your policy. Show me the real way then, cause I used the codes and templates FROM the policy page. Better yet, delete the crap from the stupid war between feya and me. Idiot admin, rly. Innoruuk 00:20, September 30, 2009 (UTC)Innoruuk
 * The self proclaimed genius can't follow basic policies. Funny that. 86.30.179.100 00:22, September 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * read PvX:ARCHIVE. Don't delete random content of page. Name it correctly. Elephantaliste Noir 00:24, September 30, 2009 (UTC)