Build talk:Me/N FA May Wastrel's

This will be vetted by next month-- Relyk 21:01, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * ^ &mdash;  ska  21:04, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

The small increase in damage and +1 energy regen really isn't worth the loss of your elite. Kracatoan 21:25, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * and that pertains to this build in what way?-- Relyk 22:04, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Possibly the fact that this is just a normal CM Mesmer without an elite so as to get the effects of this March's flux. Kracatoan 22:15, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * If you were hoping for something totally new and innovative, you're not going to find it here-- Relyk 22:24, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Im with Kracatoan. A mesmer without an elite is like a cardsharper without cards in the sleeves. This flux works better with melees, casters are not so powerful due to the fact that they just get +5 damage at all their skills. You should be able to mantain your energy, so your +1 energy is not worth it. [[Image:CR.jpg|19px]] Chonsy Rulez   16:41, 5 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Also whatthefuck did you do with the attributes and the skills? lol Backfire and Arcane echo is super energy management + wastrel spam that doesnt fit the bar and that poor CoF alone is sad. [[Image:CR.jpg|19px]] Chonsy Rulez   16:44, 5 March 2012 (UTC)
 * What the fuck is a card shaper? You frighten me chonsy.  With Love~, ♣  RąʂKɭɘş  23:30, 5 March 2012 (UTC)
 * that made no sense Chonsey-- Relyk 02:59, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I think he meant a con man who scams gambling card games? He kinda has a point. Mesmer elites are really good and he's basically saying you're going in without the mesmer's key tools if you drop your elite. -- Toraen   confer  03:05, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm going to disagree a tad here. It is true that the best tools of a mesmer are its elites. Pblock, PD, Inept, even Esurge. But, as far as I can tell, this is a variant of Build:Me/any FA Psychic Instability Wastrel's. Which, if you can effectively use your rupts, (there are 2 of them on this bar because of arcane echo'd CoF) you really don't need Psychic Instability. So, rather than having this vetted separately, why not add it as a variant on Build:Me/any FA Psychic Instability Wastrel's and then delete this variant after this month and be done with it?-- Ultimak719 LIKE A BOSS!  03:14, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Hmm, probably a better idea than this getting vetted at the end of the month. I have no objections. -- Toraen   confer  03:21, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

Lol sorry I used the fucking google translate for the similitude there and I was sure it would have fucked the entire phrase. However Toraen understood. @Ultimak yes some build dont need elites to be effective (Even Build:Me/any FA Shutdown) but in FA luxon its nonsense. Mesmers are one of the best profs in FA luxon because they render monks/healers useless. A mesmer without elite there is stupid. Chonsy Rulez  11:54, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually mesmers are one of the best professions mostly because they breach gates uberfast due to high armor ignoring damage and AoE. Miharo 12:38, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * If you want to breach gates uber fast then bring an ele. Mesmer is for shutdown, even in FA. If you kill the monk you can breach the gate. If you use the PI mesmer you waste your profession(not that it is a bad build, but if you want to breach gates use something else). [[Image:CR.jpg|19px]] Chonsy Rulez   16:45, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * You don't play fa much do you chonsy-- Relyk 18:51, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * 95% of all FA mesmers play PI(or at least Wastrels spam). What are you on about? Miharo 19:04, 9 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeeeees Relyk, except that I play only FA. So yes, I know what Im talking about. The fact is that PI mesmers break gates easily, but then when they get to Gunther theyre just like eles because they spam damage mindlessly. Common situation: Green Gate down, every mesmer that plays PI tries to run through the gate and target gunther (and fails miserably). Every serious mesmer with a shutdown build gets to the green gate with its team and shuts down the kurz monk. Luxons usually win because 1) Overwhelming damage on both Gunther and the monk or 2) A mesmer shuts down the monk. [[Image:CR.jpg|19px]] Chonsy Rulez
 * Or you solo green and solo gatekeepers before their monks even notice theyre being raped from behind. Either way, inside green just spam WW/WD on NPCs and PI the healing monk(on a WoH the WoH or Cure Hex or SoR, on a AoE spammer the SoA or Guardian or dismiss). Your example is laughable because I can say: Common situation: Green Gate down, every mesmer that plays PI waits for their team and kills of NPCs while using PI to shutdown monks. Miharo 13:50, 10 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Or you use Power Block followed by Blackout and completely shut down the monk for 17(18)-28(29) seconds, depending on your domination magic and luck with the 4040. Your example is laughable because who the fuck cares of 3 seconds KD in FA? [[Image:CR.jpg|19px]] Chonsy Rulez   14:58, 10 March 2012 (UTC)
 * My point exactly, who cares about 3 sec KD when you can just kill the NPCs? Miharo 17:01, 10 March 2012 (UTC)
 * You can shutdown monks with backfire and wastrel spam, you don't need Pblock or blackout. The damage you output is already overwhelming for monks. Well of Profane will carry matches with 2-5 monks where dedicated shutdown becomes uesless, otherwise you can overpower a couple monks without shutting them down unless they're prepared.-- Relyk 00:42, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Is this convo seriously for real? What the fuck. --Silven Shadow 23:39, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
 * FA is srs bsns  Rask ✂  ✂  ✂  ✂  23:51, 13 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Never in my life have I seen so many people arguing completely different, retarded things. Retard cookies for everybody! --Silven Shadow 07:54, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * You're hilarious!-- Relyk 09:24, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Merge
No point. No matter how it's vetted, it should be archived/trashed in about 3 weeks. Adding this to an already-vetted page just means it'll be more messy when the Flux is over. -- Jai .  -  19:52, March 9 2012 (UTC)
 * There are a couple major differences in usage when you drop PI regarding order of skills and timing, but I guess people can figure it out on their own.-- Relyk 21:48, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Votes
There isn't much point because lolflux but let's go head:
 * @Miharo: Energy is perfectly fine, Backfire will kill NPCs quickly and healers easily.
 * @Silven: Not a reason
 * @Alex: Stick Ether Feast in variants, not hard to survive on 2 regen. Profane carries teams through prots and AoE monks, the attribute bonus makes it worth bringing. You can use Scourge Healing, Healing Breeze, or similar but isn't as good. And Arcane Thievery is shit.
 * @Brave Lord: AI is more than enough energy management, otherwise your doing it wrong. Profane carries teams through prots and AoE monks. arcane mimicry and thievery won't get a boost unless it's your primary or secondary and they are still bad.
 * @Chonsy: Well you're wrong, it's FA after all. Stick Ether Feast in variants, not hard to survive on 2 regen. AI is more than enough energy management. You have the same armor as any caster. There are specific instructions on each zone on how to use the skills, what gives you the impression it's random. That's not even a viable reason anyways.

-- Relyk 09:48, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Energy is fine but AI depends on 1.4 or 2.1 cast spells. To me it's clunky. And Backfire is just awkward IMO. Cast time and cost vs. actual usefulness. Sure it's good vs. NPCs but you have WW/WD for that. Sure it can put some pressure on monks but they just cure hex it or cast PS on themselves and keep healing. Attributes are still off. Miharo 14:35, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Then you interrupt cure hex with CoF, there aren't any monks that bring PS. The alternative healers (rits, n/rt, etc.) don't have hex removal half the time. FC is at 10, so the actual casting time is lower if that matters to you. You do realize those are flux attributes right?-- Relyk 19:06, 17 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeah well, I forgot about Flux attributes. Still seems kinda clunky to me. I won't change my vote either way since my vote was Great ^^. Also AoE monks are meta(and they bring protspirit), but I hear you. Miharo 23:04, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Deep Freeze
For Auspicious? Synergy with Chaos Storm.--- IGN: Saxazax I (capital i) or Saxazax I I - (talk) 01:15, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Me/N, and Well of the Profane is kinda key because it lets you deprot gates/gunther entirely (except for ST rits - which aren't quite as powerful in PvP due to the cast times) as soon as there's a corpse. And there will be corpses. Toraen (talk) 10:26, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Ok, cool--- IGN: Saxazax I (capital i) or Saxazax I I - (talk) 02:35, 4 May 2018 (UTC)